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Posted by LorenDB 10/25/2024

We can now fix McDonald's ice cream machines(www.ifixit.com)
1112 points | 308 commentspage 2
rootusrootus 10/26/2024|
Does McD's still use these machines today? It seems like this has been going on for decades, more than long enough that pretty much everyone seems to know about it. I would have guessed that by now McD's would want to move on to a new setup that did not cause them such consistent negative PR and leave a trail of unhappy customers.
traverseda 10/26/2024||
McDonalds owns the company that makes and fixes these machines, and franchise owners foot the bill. It's a way of taking more money from franchise owners.
Reason077 10/26/2024|||
That’s not correct. Taylor Company, who supply the notorious C602 ice cream machine to more than 13,000 McDonalds franchises, is owned by Middleby Corporation of Elgin, Illinois since 2018. Previously it was part of United Technologies’ climate & controls (Carrier) unit. [1]

Not all McDonalds use the Taylor machines. Some use machines from other manufacturers such as Carpigiani [2]

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Company

[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpigiani

mattmaroon 10/26/2024|||
They do not, this is disinformation. The machines are manufactured by Taylor for McDonald’s and maintained by Taylor’s service network.

Taylor’s the largest manufacturer of commercial ice cream making equipment in the US. Franchisees also have the option of using Carpigiani machines, but they’re Italian so parts and service are not as easy to come by. And all ice cream machines are known for being easy to break, especially if used by poorly trained teenagers.

This also makes no sense, if McDonald’s wanted to make more off the franchisees from ice cream, surely they’d rather do it by having the machines work (so they can sell product). They sell the mix that goes in the machine to the franchisees. It would be idiotic to try to gouge them by making the machine crappy rather than just charging them more for the mix and using a good machine. Then they wouldn’t need to employ these imaginary service techs and the franchisees would be happier with the situation.

CamperBob2 10/26/2024||
Then why is the situation what it is? As numerous people have pointed out, other fast-food chains don't have this problem. They are able to provide ice-cream products that are consistently free of either toxins or excuses.

Occam's Razor suggests that the most likely explanation is that the McDonald's Corporation is deliberately setting their franchisees up to fail by continuing to sign contracts with Taylor. Which I agree makes no sense.

mattmaroon 10/26/2024||
That’s not what Occam’s razor would suggest at all. That’s a silly conspiracy theory that’s easily verified as false if you know anything about the ice cream industry or just bother to Google who makes the machines.

Occam’s razor might suggest that their competitors use a different machine entirely (I really don’t know but Wikipedia’s page on Taylor only mentions McDonald’s).

McDonald’s corporate making a bad decision about a machine seems a whole lot simpler than some convoluted conspiracy theory, doesn’t it?

CamperBob2 10/26/2024||
McDonald’s corporate making a bad decision about a machine seems a whole lot simpler than some convoluted conspiracy theory, doesn’t it?

That excuse wears thin after 10+ years.

dmix 10/26/2024|||
Accountants at these places evaluate the cost of replacing all the machines with a new vendor while still paying out the old contract vs internet comments

I’m sure they’ve done the math somewhere, and possibly determined this is more of a meme than an IRL business liability

mattmaroon 10/27/2024||
It should be noted that even though McDonald’s began allowing franchisees to use another brand years ago, most still do not.
mattmaroon 10/26/2024|||
It’s not an excuse, almost everyone agrees they screwed up. But it’s an explanation. They likely signed a long term contract. Then a few years ago they allowed franchisees to use another brand.
kwiens 10/26/2024||
Yes. https://github.com/rashiq/mcbroken-archive
mmmlinux 10/25/2024||
Great, They made its so defeating the lock isn't illegal. Too bad selling the tool to do it is.
dylan604 10/25/2024|
So don't sell. Open an account on GitHub and post the procedure there
greensh 10/25/2024||
from the article:

> The ruling doesn’t change the underlying statute making it illegal to share or sell tools that bypass software locks.

I think this also includes sharing code.

bebrbrhrj 10/25/2024|||
Is it trite to ask if this is blocking free speech?
delroth 10/25/2024||
This has recently been challenged in courts and rejected: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2024/08/federal-appeals-court-...

> Integral to the Court’s decision was the conclusion that Section 1201’s ban on circumvention of access restrictions is a regulation of “conduct” rather than “speech.”

roastedpeacock 10/26/2024||
Anyone know if EFF is going to attempt further appeals?
unit149 10/26/2024||
As per the US Code, title § 1201(D) "noninfringing uses" including but not limited to non-profit or archival purposes aren't a circumvention of the technological measure. No need to skirt DMCA if the fair use doctrine is in place.
yreg 10/25/2024||
I've heard plenty of stories about the MCD ice cream machines, but it doesn't add up for me. Can someone who has more insight shed some light into this?

- Are the machines listed as "broken" on https://mcbroken.com/ actually broken? Or is that more of a meme, with many just undergoing routine cleaning, etc.?

- Why does this seemingly happen only in US? In European McDonald's it's pretty much unheard of.

- Why would McDonald's Corp. be happy with the status quo? Is it some kind of tactic to squeeze more revenue from the franchises? If so, why not address it in the franchise agreement and just let restaurants sell more ice cream?

crooked-v 10/25/2024||
The short version is that the machines' sensors are extremely picky (because the stuff that goes into soft serve is just begging for massive bacterial growth if not handled correctly), and McDonald's corporate requires (I'm pretty sure by franchisee contract, not just by the copyright restrictions the article is about) that their specific chosen vendor handles it, even for minor issues.

A lot of people like to treat this as a conspiracy, but I think it's much more likely it's the corporate people being paranoid about local franchisees overriding the machines, and that leading to listeria outbreaks happening in the only non-sealed food item that isn't heated to safe temperatures shortly before it's handed off to customers.

I don't know about the contrast with Europe, but it might just be geographical size causing time delays for individual techs showing up. McDonald's franchisees are everywhere, and the U.S. is gigantic.

somethoughts 10/25/2024||
I suspect its a probably a combination of abundance of caution based on past bad experiences/lawsuits as well as also being good for margins:

The Surprising Reasons Soft-Serve Ice Cream Can Be Dangerous To Eat

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/surprising-reasons-soft-serv...

https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna7149927

From 2005:

More than 120 people were sickened after eating ice cream at their local McDonald's. The health department says the restaurant's dairy mixture somehow was contaminated with staphylococcus, and a mechanical malfunction in the soft serve machine allowed the bacteria to grow. So many people became so ill, so quickly, the director of the local emergency room told me he at first thought there was some kind of bioterrorism incident in the town.... Nancy Smith says she had taken her grandchildren for an outing, and stopped at McDonald's to buy them a treat. Her grandson Darien had a milkshake, and she says he was violently ill an hour later. He became limp and listless, Smith says, and they rushed him to the hospital, scared to death. Then she got sick. She says she had just three sips of Darien's shake, but it was enough to make her very ill. She told us she was vomiting so violently, she thought she was going to have a heart attack. She's now suing McDonald's, as are many of the other people who got sick in that incident.

pbhjpbhj 10/25/2024|||
In UK McDo often have broken ice-cream machines too, at least where I've been. It seems to be higher incidence than other fastfood outlets (Burger King, KFC), but that might be observer bias.

I just figure margins must be low on their ice-creams, so when it's broken they sell more fountain drinks and make more money than they would if the ice-cream machine was fixed.

Toorkit 10/25/2024||
How can they be low? Here it's nearly 3 euros for a thimble of ice cream lol
yreg 10/29/2024||
Also I would be surprised if people buy a soda instead of ice cream. I believe most either get an ice cream in addition to the menu or specifically because they came for an ice cream.
0x457 10/25/2024|||
> - Why does this seemingly happen only in US? In European McDonald's it's pretty much unheard of.

Because only in the US, employees fill it up above max line.

jabroni_salad 10/26/2024||
i can confirm that the mcbroken website does indeed show machines as broken which are have simply been disassembled for cleaning.
coverband 10/27/2024||
Re: specific tools staying outlawed even after this win: What about offering a tool for some legit purpose, but it just happens to be the right tool that can be used to repair the protected item?
from-nibly 10/25/2024||
Nice, the politicians were able to get some brownie points on a hot button issue without actually doing anything! Good for them, I bet they feel proud, they deserve some of the ice cream they so valiantly saved.
gkoberger 10/25/2024|
The US Copyright Office isn't elected, and the woman running it was appointed by a non-political appointee herself.

I have a pretty negative view of politics, too, but it doesn't mean we can't be happy when something good happens – no matter how small. The government doesn't pay well, and while we know the names of a dozen or so shitty self-serving jerks in Congress, most people in the government are genuine people doing it to help others.

sans_souse 10/26/2024||
It took this long to establish a Right to Repair for Ice Cream Machines... So, where shall we set the over:under for number of years til regain a Right to Repair our own cars?
Liquix 10/26/2024|
iFixit is a strange entity. Their website, repair kits, and tutorials are all excellent. The amount of success they've had in championing right to repair initiatives in legal arenas is commendable. But it's not so great that the two are intertwined. It seems inevitable that conflicts of interests will arise between their exclusive deals with manufacturers, business selling repair kits, and increasing influence in the legal system.
awestroke 10/26/2024|
I don't see it. No single manufacturer deal they make will be worth enough to them to change their strategy or values. They also know from experience that companies withdraw from such agreements or deals without warning, so they can never rely on them
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