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Posted by cf100clunk 3/31/2025

MLB says Yankees’ new “torpedo bats” are legal and likely coming(thelibertyline.com)
306 points | 413 commentspage 2
smeej 3/31/2025|
Maybe it's just me, but if I worked for a school as close to Fenway as MIT, I sure wouldn't risk putting my name on custom bats for the Yankees!
do_not_redeem 3/31/2025||
Sports advancements like this are super cool. This reminds me of how Dick Fosbury changed the high jump in 1968.

It was nice of them to reveal this early in the season—I would have loved to see the drama if they revealed it during the postseason so other teams didn't have time to catch up.

islewis 3/31/2025||
I've always wondered what the technological development of F1 would look like in other sports. This feels pretty close.
ARandumGuy 3/31/2025||
It's actually fairly common. Other sibling comments have a lot of examples, but one I'd like to focus on is the swimsuit arms race in competitive swimming. It really got started with Speedo's LZR Racer suit at the 2008 Olympics, where 98% of swimming medals were won by someone wearing one of these suits.

However, there were serious issues with cost and accessibility. These suits cost a lot of money to develop and manufacture, which was passed on to the swim teams. The LZR Racer could cost $550 per suit, with each suit only lasting a handful of races before requiring replacement. This gave a huge advantage to wealthy teams and swimmers with good sponsorship deals, and talented swimmers without a lot of financial resources were left in the dust.

Then there's the basic question of "what skills do we want to measure and reward in this sport?" With swimming, it got to the point where races were won not in the pool, but in the R&D department of swimwear companies. The swimming organizing bodies felt that swimming competitions should be focused on the athletic ability of individual swimmers instead, so advanced swimsuits were banned.

Don't get me wrong, I like F1 a lot, and part of that is the cool cutting-edge technology the teams develop. But for most sports, heavy technological development doesn't lead to more exciting competition, it just adds barriers to entry.

parineum 3/31/2025|||
> 98% of swimming medals were won by someone wearing one of these suits.

> This gave a huge advantage to ... teams and swimmers with ... sponsorship deals

Is the former caused by the latter or caused by performance enhancement?

Speedo sponsoring all likely medal winners into their new product seems like a reasonable explanation. Given that I've never heard of another brand, I assume speedo has a fairly large budget for sponsorships. I don't know anything at all about swimming though, just wanted to throw that out there.

umbra07 3/31/2025|||
I don't understand how $550 a suit is an exorbitant cost.

You're paying coaches, nutritionists, doctors, managers, etc. What's an extra $550 every now and then?

Sure, maybe a less-well off swimmer can't afford to train with the suit in every practice swim like a wealthy team/swimmer can - but that wealthy team/swimmer already has advantages in everything else.

cf100clunk 3/31/2025|||
When the National Hockey League allowed synthetic sticks (aluminum, carbon fibre) in the late 1980s there was a quick uptake as players began to learn how to get greater puck velocities over the old wooden ones. The cost to the game is the phenomena of the exploding stick, which happens far more often than with the old lumber ones and can directly affect the outcome of the game as the dejected player skates away from a missed opportunity.
jdsully 3/31/2025||
They actually try to just block without the stick until the play ends and it looks rather silly. I've also seen them dive and punch the puck which doesn't seem like it should be legal but the rules seem to be limited to prohibiting grabbing the puck.
toast0 3/31/2025||
The rules for hand pass are:

> Rule 79 – Hand Pass > 79.1 Hand Pass - A player shall be permitted to stop or “bat” a puck in the air with his open hand, or push it along the ice with his hand, and the play shall not be stopped unless, in the opinion of the on-ice officials, he has directed the puck to a teammate, or has allowed his team to gain an advantage, and subsequently possession and control of the puck is obtained by a player of the offending team, either directly or deflected off any player or official. For violations related to “closing his hand on the puck”, refer to Rule 67 – Handling Puck.

> 79.2 Defending Zone - Play will not be stopped for any hand pass by players in their own defending zone. The location of the puck when contacted by either the player making the hand pass or the player receiving the hand pass shall determine the zone it is in.

From the 2023-2024 rulebook [1], because it came up first in search. I don't think hand pass rules have changed. Basically, if your stick breaks when defending, you can go ahead and use your body to play and fling the puck to your teammates as appropriate (but not out of the defensive zone). OTOH, if your stick breaks when you're in the offensive zone, you better skate to the bench and either grab another stick or change out. Sometimes you'll see another player give their stick to the player with the broken stick and then go change.

[1] https://media.nhl.com/site/asset/public/ext/2023-24/2023-24R...

thaumasiotes 4/1/2025||
> Basically, if your stick breaks when defending, you can go ahead and use your body to play and fling the puck to your teammates as appropriate

Isn't that specifically banned?

>> and the play shall not be stopped unless, in the opinion of the on-ice officials, he has directed the puck to a teammate [...] and subsequently possession and control of the puck is obtained by a player of the offending team

subarctic 4/1/2025|||
You missed the part about it being allowed in the defending zone.
soared 3/31/2025|||
A similar feel is pro cycling and the UCI. Cycling is much cheaper to innovate and test, so the UCI is constantly and aggressively banning new things. Unfortunately consumer bikes generally follow the UCI trends so we miss out on improvements, but the sport retains its “purity”. Very important though - the fastest approach in a Tour de France stage would be a carbon fiber recumbent for the flat sections, then switching to a super light (not aero) bike for large climbs, then switching to a heavier and super aero bike for descents.

Other easy tech that was banned is seats with a lip on the back, so you could push your butt up against it to drive more power. And the “puppy paws” handlebar position - more aero but banned outside of time trials.

tmiku 3/31/2025|||
I find the road cycling arms race really fascinating too, especially for tech focused on measurement rather than performance. See the 2021 ban on diabetic-style glucose monitors during races [1], the recent restriction of carbon monoxide-based hemoglobin testing [2,3], and the possible upcoming ban on breath sensors during races [4].

[1] https://www.bikeradar.com/news/uci-bans-supersapiens [2] https://www.uci.org/pressrelease/the-uci-bans-repeated-inhal... [3] https://www.bicycling.com/news/a61677020/carbon-monoxide-reb... [4] https://archive.ph/XMrVg

krupan 3/31/2025|||
On the other hand, because there's a minimum weight for bikes, and frames and wheels are too light now, we get cool tech like motorized derailers and disc brakes
gadders 3/31/2025|||
The Aluminium Cricket bat was controversial in the 70's: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ComBathttps://en.wikipedia.org...

I guess other (banned) examples would be the LZR swim suits (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LZR_Racer) and the Nike Vaporfly (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nike_Vaporfly_and_Tokyo_2020_O...)

I think I am also right in saying that you can buy a road bike that is better than the ones permitted in the Tour de France.

lapetitejort 3/31/2025|||
> I think I am also right in saying that you can buy a road bike that is better than the ones permitted in the Tour de France.

Recumbent bikes have been banned since 1934[0]! Remarkable machines. I'd love to ride one in a civilized location one day.

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recumbent_bicycle

soared 3/31/2025|||
A very small number of teams aren’t well funded, have sponsorship issues, or whatever else and actually run less than top end components. I don’t recall who but there were bikes at either TDF or vuelta maybe last year with group sets which you could’ve just gone to the store and bought better ones.
floatrock 3/31/2025||
There are stories like this in marathon running shoes (something like 3D printed to the athlete's exact gait and basically last just a single race) and swimming (the michael phelps olympics dolphin suit).

I'm sure cycling and golf have been doing things like this since forever.

Ichthypresbyter 4/1/2025|||
Rowing had the sliding rigger boat which was banned in international competition within a year of first being used.

(In a normal racing rowing boat, the athlete sits on a sliding seat, while their shoes and the rigger with the oarlock are fixed to the boat. In the 1980s, boats were developed that had the shoes and rigger as a unit that slid, while the seat was fixed, which was more efficient as it meant that the boat hull and the athlete's mass moved together.)

On the other hand, first carbon-fibre oar shafts and later asymmetrical "hatchet" oar blades were adopted near-universally within a few years of their invention.

soared 3/31/2025|||
There are videos on YouTube of people using banned golf clubs that are super interesting - sand wedges with big holes in the club head so they slice through the sand, or comically large driver heads.
kjkjadksj 3/31/2025||
Golf actually adopted tech that probably ought to have been banned. Namely the modern ball and driver going from balata and persimmon. Pros went from driving it 260 yards to 325 sometimes longer and entire courses had to be redesigned as they would just trivially drive over fairway hazards and rough. Golf became a bomb and wedge game ever since as they can’t make certain historic courses terribly longer.

They are exploring the idea of rolling back the ball but the implications of that are endless.

nemo44x 3/31/2025||
Golf should rate gear differently for different levels of play. Most golfers need these improvements as it makes recreational golf more enjoyable. But it makes the game too easy for professionals. Gear rated for their tournaments would be better I think. But there’s a rub.

Players like to endorse gear because people want to play what the best players play. They think it will make them better. So it’s hard to endorse gear you aren’t playing with.

Theres also data that suggests longer hitting guys will be more dominant with a rollback. I don’t know but I guess the nerds figured out how to optimize golf and it’s all about distance. The days of precession and artistry may be gone. I’m not sure how to defend against bomb and gouge and not sure if we should.

iambateman 4/1/2025||
As a kid, my all-time favorite Christmas present was a Gen-1x baseball bat. It was my first -3 bat, and promised a new metal alloy that would help me hit harder. Talk about sparking the imagination!

Without question, one of the high points of childhood was going out and trying to make that bat pop.

A lot of long-term baseball fans “get it” when it comes to creative tech in the game and it’s fun to see something new with bats.

The only thing I want to point out is that baseball (and all big sports) have always been a technological arms race and always will be. It’s just part of it.

pasquinelli 3/31/2025||
> Unfortunately, the MLB reviewed the torpedo bats after the game and somehow had zero issues with them?

"Unfortunately, the MLB reviewed the torpedo bats after the game and somehow had zero issues with them", isn't a question; adding a question mark just makes me read you with an obnoxious up-tone.

RandallBrown 4/1/2025||
The question is implied. "How could they possibly have done that?"
Affric 3/31/2025||
The wonderful thing about human language is that often context implies meaning. It’s more than the words on the page.
pasquinelli 4/1/2025||
what's that got to do with what i said?
whycome 3/31/2025||
Are we entering the F1 stage of baseball and other sports? I bet there’s room for optimization with gloves and shoes and uniforms. I’m surprised teams haven’t made use of mobile recovery units when visiting away teams (instead of hotels). And there’s still gotta be ways to work around fatigue related to travel and time zone changes. I’m still surprised how basic and limited home team locker rooms can be. There are probably cool tech and social/psych solutions.
janalsncm 3/31/2025||
They’ve been Moneyballing the game for a while with analytics to the point that the MLB had to ban certain defensive techniques. (Analytics says he always hits it there, so put a bunch of defensive players there.)
jgalt212 3/31/2025|||
> I bet there’s room for optimization with gloves

Maybe so, but the demand is just not there with so many play ending up as home runs or strikeouts.

Affric 3/31/2025||
Definitely already begun.

Players diets, sleep schedules, low altitude flights…

koolba 3/31/2025||
Did it really take 125+ years for someone to realize the bat does not need to evenly taper? This seems like some seriously low lying fruit.
papercrane 3/31/2025||
Different bat profiles have been around forever, and many players have their own custom profiles that they like.

I think the key innovation that enabled this new profile is the accuracy and quality of data being collected.

Edit: Here's an article talking about some of the bat tracking technology that MLB has deployed in recent years: https://technology.mlblogs.com/introducing-statcast-2023-hig...

daedrdev 3/31/2025|||
No, different bats have been around forever, Babe Ruth's bats looks like a log compared to modern bats. However shifting the taper based on where a player gets most of their hits based on advanced tracking of their hit location is new.
abfan1127 3/31/2025||
its less about even taper and more about moving weight/center of mass around. Youth bats have been doing that for quite a while. Camwood bats is a great example of moving weight around. In their case, its a training bat.
koolba 3/31/2025||
Can you take it a step further with uneven wood density?

Like growing the tree with part of the branch under compression.

sib 3/31/2025||
Oh, I like this. Feels like something you'd see in NPB with teams recruiting Bonsai masters to grow bats.
nullbyte 3/31/2025||
From the title I was expecting genetically modified Bats that could fly out and retrieve foul balls
codexb 3/31/2025||
I'm genuinely surprised this hasn't been done before now.
bonestamp2 3/31/2025||
Ya, it's one of those simple design improvements that seem obvious once you see it, but clearly wasn't obvious because it took so long for someone to think of it.
pclmulqdq 3/31/2025||
The granny free throw and the belly putter are both better tools, but they are uncool. We can add the torpedo bat to that list.
renewiltord 3/31/2025||
Belly putting is anchoring to belly? That’s not legal.
soared 3/31/2025|||
It was legal, until bad putters became very good at putting!
pclmulqdq 3/31/2025|||
TIL. The new version of this is the "armlock putter" where you anchor to your arm instead of to your belly.
benmathes 3/31/2025|
I suspect this may result in more pitches away to these batters so they have to make contact on the narrower end of the bat.

I.e. it's a move that may well have a counter move.

xxpor 3/31/2025|
Folks will start to use longer bats then and crowd the plate. Of course that'll be countered with more inside pitching.
bob_theslob646 4/1/2025||
>Folks will start to use longer bats then and crowd the plate. (Rule 3.02 states that bats cannot be more than 2.61 inches in diameter and 42 inches in length.) [https://www.mlb.com/news/baseball-bat-history#:~:text=(Rule%...]
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