Any sufficiently advanced method of programming will start to look less like natural language and more like a programming language.

If you still don’t want to do programming, then you need some way to instruct or direct the intelligence that _will_ do the programming.

And any sufficiently advanced method of instruction will look less like natural language, and more like an education.

Natural language is pretty good for describing the technical requirements for the complex system, though. I.e. not the current code implementation, but why the current code implementation is selected vs other possible implementations. Not what code do, but what it is expected to do. Basically, most of the missing parts, that live in Jira-s, instead of your repo. It is also good, at allowing better refactoring capabilities, when all your system is described by outside rules, which could be enforced on the whole codebase. We just use programming languages, because it is easier to use in automated/computer context (and was the only way to use, to be honest, before all the LLM stuff). Though, while it gives us non-ambiguity on the local scale, it stops working on the global scale, the first moment person went and copy-pasted part of the code. Are you sure that part follows all the high-level restrictions we should to follow and is correct program? It is program that would run, when compile, but definition of run is pretty loose. In C++ program that corrupts all the memory is also runnable.

Reminds me of another recurring idea of replacing code with flowcharts. First I've seen that idea coming from some unknown Soviet professor from 80s, and then again and again from different people from different countries in different contexts. Every time it is sold as a total breakthrough in simplicity and also every time it proves to be a bloat of complexity and a productivity killer instead.

Or weak typing. How many languages thought that simplifying strings and integers and other types into "scalar", and making any operation between any operands meaningful, would simplify the language? Yet every single one ended up becoming a total mess instead.

Or constraint-based UI layout. Looks so simple, so intuitive on simple examples, yet totally failing to scale to even a dozen of basic controls. Yet the idea keeps reappearing from time to time.

Or an attempt at dependency management by making some form of symlink to another repository e.g. git modules, or CMake's FetchContent/ExternalProject? Yeah, good luck scaling that.

Maybe software engineering should have some sort of "Hall of Ideas That Definitely Don't Work", so that young people entering the field could save their time on implementing one more incarnation of an already known not good idea.

Modern programming already is very, very far from strict obedience and formal symbolism. Most programmers these days (myself included!) are using libraries, frameworks, and other features that mean what they are doing in practice is wielding sky-high abstractions, gluing things together they do not (and can not) fully understand the inner workings of.

If I create a website with Node.js, I’m not manually managing memory, parsing HTTP requests byte-by-byte, or even attempting to fully grasp the event loop’s nuances. I’m orchestrating layers of code written by others, trusting that these black boxes will behave as advertised according to my best, but deeply incomplete, understanding of them.

I'm not sure what this means for LLMs programming, but I already feel separated from the case Dijkstra lays out.

> Remark. As a result of the educational trend away from intellectual discipline, the last decades have shown in the Western world a sharp decline of people's mastery of their own language: many people that by the standards of a previous generation should know better, are no longer able to use their native tongue effectively, even for purposes for which it is pretty adequate.

Compare that to:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43522966

I read this when I was younger, but I only now get it, and realize how true it all is.

13) Humans writing code is an inherently flawed concept. Doesn't matter what form the code takes. Machine code, assembly language, C, Perl, or a ChatGPT prompt. It's all flawed in the same way. We have not yet invented a technology or mechanism which avoids it. And high level abstraction doesn't really help. It hides problems only to create new ones, and other problems simply never go away.

21) Loosely coupled interfaces made our lives easier because it forced us to compartmentalize our efforts into something manageable. But it's hard to prove that this is a better outcome overall, as it forces us to solve problems in ways that still lead to worse outcomes than if we had used a simpler [formal] logic.

34) We will probably end up pushing our technical abilities to the limit in order to design a superior system, only to find out in the end that simpler formal logic is what we needed all along.

55) We're becoming stupider and worse at using the tools we already have. We're already shit at using language just for communicating with each other. Assuming we could make better programs with it is nonsensical.

For a long time now I've been upset at computer science's lack of innovation in the methods we use to solve problems. Programming is stupidly flawed. I've never been good at math, so I never really thought about it before, but math is really the answer to what I wish programming was: a formal system for solving a problem, and a formal system for proving that the solution is correct. That's what we're missing from software. That's where we should be headed.

By chance I came just today across GitHub's SpecLang:

https://githubnext.com/projects/speclang/

Funny coincidence!

I leave it here for the nice contrast it creates in light of the submission we're discussing.

When was it written? The date says 2010 but dijkstra died in 2002.

Dijkstra also advocated for proving the correctness of imperative code using the composition of a set of simple rules, and most programmers ignore that aspect of his work too.

A great find!

The whole thing seems a step (or several steps) backwards also in terms of UX. I mean surely there was a reason why ls was named ls, and so forth?

A bonus point is that he had also something to say about a real or alleged degeneration of natural languages themselves.