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Posted by thebeardisred 3 days ago

JavaScript Trademark Update(deno.com)
880 points | 346 commentspage 4
ingen0s 2 days ago|
ughmmm.so squatting.
zeroCalories 3 days ago||
This seems like such a pain in the ass to fight. Why not just rename the language? Most people are done with js anyway and just use ts.
jenadine 3 days ago||
Btw, The language is called ECMAScript
mmastrac 2 days ago|||
Literally nobody, outside of formal documents and perhaps pedants, uses that catastrophe of a name.
runarberg 2 days ago||||
If you are gonna change the name to anything, change it to js. But also, don’t change the name of the language, especially not to ECMAScript.
zzo38computer 2 days ago||
It is already called ECMAScript; they do not need to change it. It is also called JavaScript. (I don't know if there is trademark issues with ECMA too though)

However, the name "JavaScript" (and "ECMAScript") is in use enough anyways (like is described in the article), so Oracle shouldn't properly restrict others to use it in this way.

ajkjk 2 days ago||||
no it's not, that's a bureaucratic hoop-jump
echelon 2 days ago|||
Does everyone else pronounce that as "eczema script", too?
ranguna 1 day ago|||
No, everyone I know literally pronounces it as ecma script.
wiseowise 2 days ago|||
"EnemaScript"
echelon 2 days ago||
I mean, I don't think of it as a rebuke of JavaScript. I've just found it to be the most natural pronunciation for that sequence of letters. I really can't read it any other way.
throwawayoldie 3 days ago||
I'd like to believe that most people have switched over to TS but I wouldn't count on it until I've seen the numbers, which I am currently too lazy to look up.
oceansky 2 days ago||
"We're now firmly in the TypeScript era. 67% of respondents stated they write more TypeScript than JavaScript code – while the single largest group consisted of people who only write TypeScript."

https://2024.stateofjs.com/en-US/usage/

throwawayoldie 2 days ago||
Nice to hear, thanks.
flkenosad 3 days ago||
Node is about to become irrelevant. As soon as Microsoft ships TypeScript 7.
cakoose 3 days ago||
Why will TypeScript 7 make Node.js irrelevant?

In TypeScript 7, the compiler will be written in Go instead of TS. But the compiler will still produce JS code as its output and so Node.js is still relevant for running that JS code.

Or is there something else about TypeScript 7 that will make Node.js irrelevant?

cluckindan 3 days ago|||
How does a 10x faster TS to JS compiler make a JS runtime irrelevant?
roman_soldier 2 days ago|||
Typescript 7 is not a replacement for node, it is a language spec and compiler, but Bun _could_ be the preferred choice for dev using a Javascript runtime.
lerp-io 2 days ago||
bun is not faster than node, why do people keep thinking this lmao. v8 runtime is like x4 more performant than spidermonkey which is what bun uses.
sgammon 2 days ago||
Bun uses JSC from Apple, not Spidermonkey.
rockwotj 3 days ago|||
Can you elaborate? Are you conflating node and javascript?
wiseowise 2 days ago||
You made a fool of yourself.
charcircuit 3 days ago|
>Everyone uses “JavaScript” to describe a language—not a brand.

It can be both.

>Everyone knows JavaScript isn’t an Oracle product

But older people should know that it was a Sun product and Oracle bought Sun.

Edit: Sun actually only licensed the name. But in the renewal it points to an Oracle product called Oracle JavaScript Extention Toolkit.

https://tsdr.uspto.gov/documentviewer?caseId=sn75026640&docI...

sockmeistr 3 days ago||
But it was never a Sun product? Java was a Sun product, giving JavaScript a name with "Java" in it was the mistake that created this whole mess.
fc417fc802 2 days ago||
Rename it GoScript this time around.
mosdl 2 days ago||
It was livescript originally.
scosman 3 days ago|||
Java is a Sun product, but Java has nothing to do with Javascript except a confusing name overlap.

Javascript was written at Netscape.

ndiddy 2 days ago||
The JavaScript name came out of a cross-licensing deal between Netscape and Sun where Netscape would bundle a copy of the JVM with their browser. Sun needed a way to put the JVM on most Windows users' computers to get developers to write Java software instead of Windows software, and they knew Microsoft wouldn't ship a product that would threaten the Windows platform's domination, so they figured that bundling with Netscape was their next best option. If you read the initial JavaScript press release ( https://www.tech-insider.org/java/research/1995/1204.html ), it's mainly marketed as a way to write glue code to make it possible for Java applets (where the real application logic would go) to interact with an HTML page:

> With JavaScript, an HTML page might contain an intelligent form that performs loan payment or currency exchange calculations right on the client in response to user input. A multimedia weather forecast applet written in Java can be scripted by JavaScript to display appropriate images and sounds based on the current weather readings in a region. A server-side JavaScript script might pull data out of a relational database and format it in HTML on the fly. A page might contain JavaScript scripts that run on both the client and the server. On the server, the scripts might dynamically compose and format HTML content based on user preferences stored in a relational database, and on the client, the scripts would glue together an assortment of Java applets and HTML form elements into a live interactive user interface for specifying a net-wide search for information.

> Java programs and JavaScript scripts are designed to run on both clients and servers, with JavaScript scripts used to modify the properties and behavior of Java objects, so the range of live online applications that dynamically present information to and interact with users over enterprise networks or the Internet is virtually unlimited. Netscape will support Java and JavaScript in client and server products as well as programming tools and applications to make this vision a reality.

> "Programmers have been overwhelmingly enthusiastic about Java because it was designed from the ground up for the Internet. JavaScript is a natural fit, since it's also designed for the Internet and Unicode-based worldwide use," said Bill Joy, co-founder and vice president of research at Sun. "JavaScript will be the most effective method to connect HTML-based content to Java applets."

This was all implemented, and Java applets had full interoperability with JavaScript. Applets could call JavaScript functions, and JavaScript functions could call applet methods. Of course over time people gave up on Java applets and JavaScript became a good enough language to write real application logic directly in it. It's true that JavaScript now has virtually nothing to do with Java, but that wasn't the case initially, and the name has at least some logic behind it.

scosman 2 days ago||
Ah, great background.

One more tidbit I just learned: there was a Netscape/Sun deal around the name, so the registered trademark has some legal history. It's not that Sun (and then Oracle) just claimed rights to something Netscape made.

nailer 3 days ago|||
No. I was around then and nobody thought of JS as a Sun product.
adolph 2 days ago||
I'm trying to imagine the alternative history where James Gosling was given several days to develop a workable in-browser scripting language instead of Brendan Eich.
BrendanEich 13 hours ago||
Just FYI, I was reliably informed that jag did java.util.Date as shipped in JDK 1.0. Ta!