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Posted by robtherobber 8/31/2025

Google: 'Your $1000 phone needs our permission to install apps now' [video](www.youtube.com)
564 points | 570 commentspage 5
microflash 8/31/2025|
"You'd need our keys to enter your house."
specproc 8/31/2025||
I guess this is the thing, they're not our houses. I'm increasingly of the perspective that phones are just a tax, an entry requirement for a hostile society.

Spent a week with it uncharged in my drawer recently, that was great, should try that again.

ksec 8/31/2025||
It is really wired when I learned a few years ago the landlord has a spare key to my rented flat and could go in whenever he wants. And this sounds like it.
franktankbank 8/31/2025||
I'm going to be fucking pissed if I can't use AlfaOBD. I've saved myself thousands doing simple repairs which required that interaction.
mathiaspoint 8/31/2025||
Don't use smartphones at all, they're only bad for you and you don't need them. Do anything you can to either get away from them or start moving away from them.
_aavaa_ 8/31/2025||
And use what? A Linux laptop we carry around with us?

This is just letting them win. And if you think the forced pushing for control over what we can do with our computers will simply leave Linux alone, I don’t know what to tell you.

ndriscoll 8/31/2025|||
Handheld PCs like steam deck or legion go seem like a compelling value, at least if you were going to consider a phone in the $500+ price range. Maybe also something like the Mecha comet on the lower end. If you're in an area where banks require an app, you could then go for the absolute cheapest phone you can find (which can probably be years out of date since the whole exercise has nothing to do with security) and treat it as a single purpose device.
vel0city 8/31/2025|||
A gaming handheld isn't anywhere near as portable as a smartphone, and generally any general input complaints of a smartphone are even worse on such a device. They're great for gaming, OK for something like watching a movie on it, but otherwise they're pretty bad for even typing short things.

And they're far from pocketable. My Legion Go is in its case in my backpack when I'm on the go.

Honestly netbooks and ultra portable mini notebooks of yore were more portable and useful for a general on the go portable PC. The gaming handhelds are better from a gaming perspective with their far more powerful graphics power and built in controller grips but the general computing experience is pretty crap.

mycall 8/31/2025||
> And they're far from pocketable.

If only fashion could redefine what pocketable means.

It is very hard to beat a modern smartphone as a wearable device, but it can't be the end of evolution for wearable compute.

vel0city 9/1/2025||
I get that what is "pocketable" can change over time. After all, you go back in time to 2007 and show them an XL iPhone and they'd think you're insane to suggest people see these as pocketable.

But these handheld gaming consoles are huge. They're pretty thick since they have larger cooling systems. They have moulded grips that make these bulbous protrusions on the sides. They have joysticks that stick out and catch on things. Meanwhile they're much more fragile than most mass market phones out there.

mycall 9/3/2025||
Backpacks are pretty popular these days, so I can imagine an online computer with all day battery running things.. especially with VR glasses for on the go (joysticks are out of the way for GPD win 5 or onexplayer g1)
_aavaa_ 8/31/2025|||
Can I fit it in my pocket? Can I make a call? Take a photo?

The steam deck is great, but it’s not build for those things.

And there is no reason to cede ground on entire form factors. This behaviour will not stop at phones (or tablets, or smartwatches).

ndriscoll 9/1/2025||
The Mecha Comet appears to be pocketable and comes with a camera. I haven't actually used a phone to make a call when out of the house for like 15 years, so the whole "mobile phone" part seems pointless to me. Actually pretty much the only reason I have a phone number is for MFA. Add a GPS module (ideally built in, but could be bluetooth), and it seems like it'd just be an upgrade over a phone.

Anyway, there are also other Linux devices others have pointed out in the phone form factor like the pine phone, and tablet/notebooks from e.g. GPD. So the form factor is there, but you might need to look at things that are advertised as small computers with touch screens (because that's what they are). So "handheld PC", "pocket computer", etc.

noisy_boy 8/31/2025||||
> And use what? A Linux laptop we carry around with us?

Even if you do that, it won't work in many cases because even in the government agencies, there are some that have gone app-only mode.

otterley 8/31/2025|||
Or you could start a business making your own completely open phones. If there’s truly a market for that, you could become extremely wealthy.
_aavaa_ 8/31/2025|||
“If there’s truly a market” monopolies, monopsonies, and anti competitive behaviour would never be a problem.
otterley 8/31/2025||
What is either company doing unlawfully that’s preventing a disruptive smartphone competitor from arising? Being a duopoly is not in itself unlawful unless either is taking active steps to prevent others from competing in the market.
mathiaspoint 8/31/2025|||
A truly open phone is just a pocketable Linux laptop with an LTE modem. These already exist, companies like GPD make them.
otterley 8/31/2025||
I’m not sure something with a form factor of half the size of a sheet of office paper would suit the market for a typical smartphone.
TeaBrain 8/31/2025|||
I've recently eaten at several restaurants where the menus were only available via a link reachable from a QR code. At the last place, I asked if the 13 page menus were available in physical form and the waiter explained that they didn't have any. Technically, a phone doesn't need to be that "smart" to reach a QR code and access a web page, but it's just one more way that people are being locked into using phones for tasks that previously didn't require them.
zahlman 8/31/2025|||
> At the last place, I asked if the 13 page menus were available in physical form and the waiter explained that they didn't have any.

I would walk out.

mathiaspoint 8/31/2025|||
I know. You just figure it out. QR code menus aren't worth effectively selling yourself into slavery.
hoppp 8/31/2025|||
I need them for my bank and public transport. It sucks but I am locked in. Its a national security issue for Europe to rely on google or apple but seems politicians don't care
gruez 8/31/2025||
>for my bank

You can't access it via browser? Maybe there's a few fintechs that are app-only (think robinhood, at least initially) but it's not like all banks only offer access via smartphones.

>public transport

???

me_bx 8/31/2025|||
Many banks in EU countries make it mandatory to have their smartphone app installed in order to validate operations clients perform in their web browsers :/
dotancohen 8/31/2025|||
What do they reply when you tell them you do not own a smartphone?

Even if you do own such a device, they don't need to know that.

Telaneo 8/31/2025||
They give you a hardware token that spits out some numbers and use that as your second factor instead. Usually after a lot more fiddling than a TOTP app would be.

Or they don't and tell you to use a different bank.

mathiaspoint 8/31/2025|||
Sure if you truly need the Android HSM Walmart sells $40 tablets that can run that. You can buy one and keep it in your desk drawer just for banking.
lawn 8/31/2025||||
In Sweden banks require you to have the BankID authentication app to login on web page (and banking apps, and many other pages).

Banks may offer a physical device but that's another device you have to being with you, and it's not supported by all services anyway.

While not required the same way as water or air is required, it's super limiting and inconvenient to live in Sweden and not have access to the BankID app (either on Android or iOS).

hoppp 8/31/2025||||
My bank is revolut and Im very happy with them. Im a digital nomad and I can't keep making new bank accounts when I move to a new country.

Their website is very limited and for account recovery only.

mmh0000 8/31/2025||
You’re very happy with your bank the has a very limited website? Why?

My main banks, Fidelity and a local credit union, both offer websites that let me do anything I want with my money from a website. No spyware apps needed.

hoppp 8/31/2025||
I don't think they spy on me more than a normal website does and I really don't have the need to use a web interface. Its not a problem as far as UX goes. Also as I wrote they do have a website, just not as feature rich.
const_cast 8/31/2025||
Of course they spy on you more, one is a website and the other is an executable you run on your computer.

I would navigate to downloadmoreram.com. I would NOT download moreram.exe and run it. Would you? Fuck no!

Seriously, take a step back and consider why they're pushing the app so much. Why do businesses do things? Money. Its all very simple, we just have to be honest with ourselves.

hoppp 9/1/2025||
As a digital nomad without permanent address I am happy to not have to change bank accounts every time I move. Thats it.
const_cast 9/1/2025||
And that's great, but there's tradeoffs. You're not allowed to simply proclaim the tradeoffs don't exist.
frm88 9/1/2025|||
Tickets for public transport - mostly in the case of busses - can only be purchased via the app in my country. They used to have ticket machines but these have been phased out over the years at bus stations. Train and subway tickets still work via machines but busses are app only, in many cases you can't even buy a ticket with the driver anymore.
ksec 8/31/2025|||
Depending on which part of the world you are in. It is increasingly impossible to do it. Post COVID, Cash is no longer accepted in many stores or restaurants. Smaller shops that used to avoid VISA and Master now accept them as well, at the expense of slight increase in menu price.

Landlord would rather leave shops empty than rent it at lower price. In order to combat rental restaurants cut cost by having QR Code ordering system.

The uses of QR Code, whether it is for payment or information makes Smartphone mandatory in those places.

Spending Money online with VISA or master now requires Mobile App log in for Authentication. Government Digital Log in System now also default to Apps.

I may be missing a few things, and there will be many more things to come that moves to Mobile Apps only direction.

m01 8/31/2025||
Surely you can still pay with plastic cards, at least if the venue advertises accepting the big card issuers?

The latest neobank might require an app, but I'd be surprised if you couldn't find any bank in your country that allows you to spend money without using mobile apps.

Ask if you can order/pay without using the QR code. I'd be surprised if venues didn't have a paper menu as backup.

Telaneo 8/31/2025||
> Ask if you can order/pay without using the QR code. I'd be surprised if venues didn't have a paper menu as backup.

For newer restaurants, I really wouldn't bet on this being a thing. Or if they do, it's the ones they had before they updated their menus to QR codes, and thus might not be accurate any more.

It's like being blind and asking for the braille menu. Sure, they should have one, but don't bet on them having one.

And even if you know what you want and can pay in cash, even if they're legally bound to take your money at that point, you're working against the current and on some level being a (principled) ass to the staff serving you, who probably had no say in the system they're now having to deal with. It wouldn't even surprise me if some of these places have gone no-cash to the point of not having any place to put your cash after you've paid.

The actual solution is probably 'go somewhere else', but we all how that might go.

kmeisthax 8/31/2025|||
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binary132 8/31/2025||
the only correct take
oldpersonintx2 8/31/2025||
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_knzv 8/31/2025||
[dead]
gregorygoc 8/31/2025||
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codedokode 8/31/2025||
I don't understand, you like paying $1000 and not being able to install apps?
otterley 8/31/2025||
There are hundreds of thousands of apps in both app stores.
ulrikrasmussen 8/31/2025|||
What a weird argument. Just because there is a lot of apps doesn't mean that you are free to install whatever app you want, and it certainly puts restrictions on what the app developers can do. No way to escape the Apple tax on transactions, for example, which is just rent seeking behavior.
otterley 8/31/2025||
It’s not a “weird” argument; it’s a perfectly reasonable counter to the claim of “not being able to install apps.”

Besides, what app do you want to install that’s not available? And what’s it for?

And why should app users care what the expenses of the publisher are?

codedokode 9/1/2025||
Any app with adult content (even text content) is not allowed. So a significant part of culture is banned from app store and iphones.
otterley 9/1/2025||
Is the Web not good enough?
ulrikrasmussen 9/5/2025||
By that argument you don't need apps at all.
otterley 9/5/2025||
In many cases, you don’t. Lots of apps are thin wrappers around websites.
codedokode 8/31/2025|||
Telegram version from app store doesn't allow to view adult channels (not only porn - you can find that elsewhere - but adult bloggers etc).
otterley 9/2/2025||
Do you have evidence of this? I did some research and couldn't find anything that supports your claim.
codedokode 9/3/2025||
I read about this multiple times, including authors of the channels complaining that their channel became not accessible in iOS version of Telegram. Sorry I don't have official link - Telegram seems not to tell about it on their site, as well as Apple - but if you google, you will find users sharing workarounds like [1] [2].

Also, (according to Durov, who is not very reliable source) Apple forced Telegram to remove animated eggplant and peach emojis [3].

Also, while little unrelated, Apple complied when it was requested to remove VPN apps from app store for Russian users, and if I remember correctly it complied with similar censorship requests from Chinese government.

[1] https://techspace.africa/how-to-enable-sensitive-content-on-...

[2] https://www.reddit.com/r/Telegram/comments/ejdjyg/unblock_te...

[3] https://www.reddit.com/r/Telegram/comments/r3ijtf/apple_comp...

benoau 8/31/2025|||
It feels like they are harmonizing their policies to present a united stand against the DMA: they both now charge similar fees on using external payments, they both now claim absolute veto over what software may exist.
fabian2k 8/31/2025|||
And people have been complaining about this for the same amount of time.
gdulli 8/31/2025|||
Anyone who bought an Apple device is complicit in the legitimacy of this practice to the point of it spreading.
bdangubic 8/31/2025|||
so what you are saying here is that Apple "won", yes? They were right since forever and Google is just getting the memo...?
tkiolp4 8/31/2025||
I read it as both Google and Apple are shit. We should stop using their products step by step.
bdangubic 8/31/2025||
what’s the alternative? huawei?! :)
OutOfHere 8/31/2025|||
That's just stating the obvious because it is a strong reason why Android users chose Android all this time.
93po 8/31/2025|||
google doing this doesnt mean apple is any better. i was team android from the very beginning and a huge part of that was, from the start, android was much more friendly towards customization, modification, and running whatever software you wanted. i eventually switched to iphone but if i still cared about what i originally did, i'd be super annoyed at google
baxuz 8/31/2025||
Whataboutism. The topic is about Android.

And your concern has been addressed in the first 20 seconds of the video.

rafram 8/31/2025||
Knew it was Rossmann from the title before even clicking. He genuinely always seems so miserable. Does he ever talk about positive things?
potamic 8/31/2025||
Acquainting people with consumer rights is a very positive thing! Why do you think otherwise?
jondwillis 8/31/2025|||
What sort of positive things would you have him talk about?
timbit42 9/3/2025|||
Sometimes he talks about his dog.
npteljes 9/1/2025|||
That's a valid reason not to subscribe to his channel, but not a reason to dismiss the point just because the discussion started from a video of his.
on_the_train 8/31/2025|||
Yup, cpt Drama is of course right there. It's disingenuous at this point. He doesn't care, he's just sweeping up tech drama
slashtab 8/31/2025|||
“Ignorance is bliss”
zenonu 8/31/2025||
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rafram 8/31/2025|||
That’s a silly response. I don’t think Rossmann is really a force for good. He kvetches about New York incessantly for years, moves to Austin with much fanfare about how much better and more free Texas is, now kvetches incessantly about Austin. When manufacturers don’t open their devices enough, he complains; when they do, he complains. No matter the subject, he is impossible to please.
xerox13ster 8/31/2025|||
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ninjagoo 8/31/2025|||
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rafram 8/31/2025||
You don't need to be a pop star to have an opinion on Beyoncé.

(And no, I haven't publicly spoken about American consumer rights, but I have been interviewed in the "newspaper of record" as a representative of an organization that works to end a genocide. If that counts!)

ninjagoo 8/31/2025||
> And no, I haven't publicly spoken about American consumer rights, but I have been interviewed in the "newspaper of record" as a representative of an organization that works to end a genocide. If that counts!

That does count, yes. It also doesn't change the fact that publicly posting such a strong negative view of Rossmann context-free amounts to an ad-hominem, unless you link that negative opinion to a good reason on why his take on Google's harmful actions shouldn't be a topic of discussion. Otherwise it just comes across as an attempt to suppress his views or get people to discount his views.

A tactic you're likely familiar with, from being a target of it. Which makes it all the more surprising that you would wield it yourself, against a consumer advocate no less.

ipaddr 8/31/2025|||
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th0ma5 8/31/2025|
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tomhow 9/1/2025||
We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45084014 and marked it off topic.
tjwebbnorfolk 8/31/2025|||
> Why should people have the freedom to spread diseases?

Do you want to bring back leper colonies, then? Should it be illegal to buy eggs from the grocery store while sick with a communicable disease? All kinds of horrific policies can be justified to prevent disease spread.

th0ma5 8/31/2025||
Good point I was too generic, why should people be allowed to spread COVID specifically? Most certainly I can be arrested today for injecting people with dirty needles?
tjwebbnorfolk 9/1/2025||
Getting sick occasionally with stuff is part of regular, normal life.

Why is covid special? If you are afraid of it, then how about YOU stay home and triple-mask and sanitize your whole life. Disease and dirt and mold and shit is everywhere. Get used to it.

The comparison to stabbing someone with a poisoned needle is insane.

th0ma5 9/3/2025||
Do not breathe on people or around other people and then you can't be arrested for assault I'd think. It is wild that you feel justified in so much harm. Seek help.
quantummagic 8/31/2025|||
Agreed. It's two separate issues though. Someone who did nothing but donate $100 to a cause they believed in, should still not lose access to their bank accounts, without any legal proceedings or recourse.
ragequittah 8/31/2025|||
I believe they froze assets of the main organizers and people who were actively blocking city streets. After many warnings to discontinue the illegal activity over weeks and weeks. And they could only do it for max a month.
th0ma5 8/31/2025|||
I can be arrested for donating money for any kind of terrorists cause or group, however.
Levitz 8/31/2025||
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th0ma5 8/31/2025||
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