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Posted by xrayarx 7 days ago

How can England possibly be running out of water?(www.theguardian.com)
355 points | 501 commentspage 6
golemiprague 4 days ago|
[dead]
RagnarD 4 days ago||
[flagged]
pjc50 4 days ago||
"Socialist"? Hardly.

I do not think people would accept the prices for desalinated water produced at UK energy prices. Nor is it terribly easy to find somewhere to put the plant and its required piping. I wonder if someone could give us a back of the envelope estimate for land area required?

monadgonad 4 days ago||
The article, and especially much of the discussion here, is about how privatisation has led to this situation. Privatisation of a public utility which _even in many other developed liberal capitalist countries_ is not privatised. Yet to you this is not evidence that we are an extreme example of neoliberalism, but somehow “defacto socialist” and your solution is throwing fuel on the fire with more privatisation. You’re living on a different planet, mate.
arrowsmith 5 days ago||
No mention of the fact that our population has grown by 20% (by official statistics, likely much more) in just 30 years?
endtime 5 days ago||
The subtitle of the article mentions it:

> While famously rainswept, climate crisis, population growth and profligacy mean the once unthinkable could be possible

Also from the article:

> No new reservoir has been built in 30 years despite significant population growth

arrowsmith 5 days ago||
I stand corrected.
specproc 5 days ago||
The problem with the UK is not population growth. 20 percent over 30 years is neither exceptional nor unmanageable.

Population growth is by and large a good thing, it means more people working, paying tax, making pension contributions. More doctors, scientists and devs, but also more carers, cleaners, builders and farm workers. If you want to see what a falling population does, go check out a small town or village across most of Europe, it's not pretty.

The problem is that we've sold everything important to a private sector that has zero incentive to invest for the long term. The government has a vital role to play in everything from water to homebuilding, which a cross party consensus has abdicated.

In the case of water, we've not had a new reservoir built since Major. The argument for privatisation was that the market would allow for more efficient allocation of resources in line with supply and demand, but the experience of the last thirty here has pretty conclusively disproved this logic. See also the retreat from housebuilding.

Yet somehow this is all the fault of population, and implicitly immigration. We're hurtling towards Nigel Fucking Farage as PM because no mainstream politician is willing to rock the boat with our rentier "investors".

bufio 4 days ago||
Lots of Uber Eats drivers.
ben_w 5 days ago|||
They did mention population growth, and also:

  The industry has said that about 20% of all treated water is lost to leaks.
helqn 5 days ago|||
So it’s easy to fix. There is just no political will.

I see the same in my own country. Population growth with no end in sight, infrastructure thoroughly stressed, nobody does anything about it.

tempfile 5 days ago||
What's the "easy fix"? Mass deportations?
helqn 5 days ago||
Stopping immigration in its tracks is the first step. If anything it doesn’t stop increasing. Then we can talk about the next steps.
KaiserPro 4 days ago|||
Congratulations! now you have a island at the wrong end of a population boom.

All of your former productive workers are now retired, and the rest are expected to pay for the retirees and aging infrastructure.

Now, is growing by a million a year a good way to build long term? no.

Is depopulation going to make the country better? also no.

Immigrants aren't the problem here, They're not the one scaring away buisness, not building homes, not changing the law to make needed changes.

The people who are to blame are the commentariat and the rest of the "political calss" who refuse to accept blame or change.

WhaleClub 4 days ago||
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richrichardsson 4 days ago|||
Investment is the easy fix, but it's easier to blame immigrants than do that.
tonyhart7 5 days ago||
"our population has grown by 20%"

which one is grown and which one is imported ???

freen 4 days ago||
When you put foxes in charge of the henhouse, are you surprised that all the hens will be eaten?

Tories think government is the problem, thus when they govern, they break the government, which in turn results in situations like this, which the tories can use to argue that government is the problem.

momiforgot 4 days ago||
England’s water crisis: decades of underinvestment, privatised firms extracting rents, and a state too broke to fix pipes. Fortunately, the establishment has a brilliant plan: escalate with Russia, trigger a limited nuclear exchange, and get a neat lattice of new reservoirs in the form of fresh craters - conveniently clustered around the Home Counties. As an act of war, NIMBY rules won’t apply.

So next time you think war spending is fiscally insane, remember: it’s not waste, it’s water strategy. World-class ingenuity from the people who once ran an empire.

zkmon 5 days ago||
By the time the water issue become very serious in England, there would be other far more serious issues, globally and locally, that will dwarf the water issue. For instance, water issue around the world would drive the people out, water wars breaking out, drought and food crisis, powerful nations simply taking over resource-rich lands globally and so on. A swing back to medieval times.
pandemic_region 4 days ago|
On the other hand, dried-up England will not be a target for migrating to so that's a net positive for the current political constellation.
CWIZO 4 days ago|
It looks like we will be forever looking for solutions when we keep on ignoring animal farming in these conversations. Not even a single mention of the orders of magnitude more of water that is required for animal agriculture vs just growing plants directly for human consumption.

Would it solve everything? No. But it would solve a whole lot and the fact that someone that specialises in environmentalism doesn't even mention it shows just how far we are from solving this.

declan_roberts 4 days ago|
I don't get it. Cattle eat grass. Grass is extraordinarily efficient at using water. It's what would normally be growing there without humans!

70% of the UK is farmland and I'm willing to bet much of that is non-irrigated pasture.

peterfirefly 4 days ago||
> It's what would normally be growing there without humans!

A lot of it (most of it, likely) would be forest.

declan_roberts 4 days ago||
No it would not unless you also removed all grazing animals.