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Posted by chhum 2 days ago

Amazon strategised about keeping water use secret(www.source-material.org)
237 points | 232 commentspage 2
Reason077 2 days ago|
What happens to water that a data center “uses”? Is it warmed up and returned to the environment? Contaminated and sent to wastewater? Evaporated into the air?
charles_f 2 days ago||
> a commitment to “return more water than it uses by 2030”.

How would that even be possible?

bryan_w 1 day ago|
Some are adding/funding water treatment plants tre reduce the load from the city water main
julianozen 2 days ago||
Dumb question, but is this done with fresh water?

If so, why?

If not, does it matter how much water is used?

hwillis 2 days ago|
Its freshwater and has to be freshwater because it goes through pipes and/or is evaporated. Corrosion, scaling and fouling are all issues.

Even if seawater was easy to use and datacenters were near the shore, it would produce very saline brine which would be difficult to safely get rid of.

julianozen 1 day ago||
Thanks!
krunger 2 days ago||
Sensing this is the new global warming threat replacement
1vuio0pswjnm7 2 days ago||
""It would be better if they could own up to it," said a current Amazon software developer, who asked to remain anonymous for fear of retaliation. "Even if they said it was a low priority, at least that would be honest.""

HN commentary on water use by so-called "tech" companies usually includes a number of mindlessly-parroted, bad faith "arguments"

One of these is to try to compare the new (additive) water use by non-essential data centers with existing (non-additive) water use by agriculture

Putting aside that (a) data centers are non-essential and not comparable to food, water or shelter and (b) agricultural use is not new, these "arguments" are also ignoring that (c) the so-called "tech" companies are trying to hide the data

Employees of these so-called "tech" companies might be experiencing guilt over this dishonest tactic, but not enough to make them quit

When their employer hides the data this makes accurate comparisons, e.g., to existing water use by other recipients, difficult if not impossible

Does agriculture also try to hide its water use

If it did, then HN comments could not attempt bad faith comparisons

Because there would be no data to cite

ajkjk 2 days ago||
no opinion on the rest of the point, but, why do you keep writing "so-called" in front of tech companies? They are called that because they are tech companies; the word's meaning is widely agreed upon.
1vuio0pswjnm7 18 hours ago||
d2FzICsz
jandrewrogers 2 days ago||
This is a reaction to the unwarranted fear-mongering in the media over water usage by data centers. The amount of water is utterly inconsequential. Growing corn on the same land the data centers currently occupy would consume more water and provide far less value.

We should question the motives of whoever orchestrated a "story" out of this non-story and is pushing it in the media. It obviously isn't being done in good faith.

orwin 2 days ago|
Agree in spirit, but 'Growing corn on the same land the data centers currently occupy would consume more water and provide far less value' makes the argument weak because those 'agriculture is barely 2% of GDP' argument are like 'brain is barely 2% of your mass'.
exasperaited 2 days ago||
The company that literally named itself after a river and the threatened habitat it runs through.
xhkkffbf 2 days ago||
This isn't really about using water as much as dealing with all of the heat that comes out of computation. The water is just the simplest way to dispose of the heat.

Isn't there some better way we can, perhaps, turn some of the heat back into something useful? Maybe heat a building? Or turn it back into electricity. It doesn't have to be an efficient conversion because it's now 100% wasted.

cogman10 2 days ago||
> Maybe heat a building?

I'm a big fan of district heating, but it's something that needs to be built before the datacenter is. It also doesn't really work well if the datacenter isn't in an already cool region.

> Or turn it back into electricity.

The temps aren't high enough to do that easily. You need boiling water to generate electricity, and chips don't like running at or above 100C.

It's possible you could use a heat pump to turn hot water into boiling water, but that will stop working when temps get out of band. You might be able do it with a sterling engine, but you'd, ironically, need a supply of cool water to keep those running.

jodrellblank 1 day ago||
> "You need boiling water to generate electricity"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_vapour_turbine

fruitworks 2 days ago||
the efficiency of converting it to electricity would be low, due to low absolute temperature difference and thus carnot effeciency.

I think it could be higher with germanium semiconductors, as you could run them at a higher temp and get superheated steam

DoneWithAllThat 2 days ago||
The level of obsession some people have over data center water usage is completely unhinged.
Zababa 2 days ago|
> Amazon’s data centres were projected to use 7.7 billion gallons of water a year by 2030, according to the leaked strategy memo, which was circulated within the company in 2022.

From https://www.usgs.gov/water-science-school/science/total-wate...:

> Water use in the United States in 2015 was estimated to be about 322 billion gallons per day (Bgal/d), which was 9 percent less than in 2010.

It doesn't seem to be very much water at all.