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Posted by samclemens 4 days ago

Jack Kerouac, Malcolm Cowley, and the difficult birth of On the Road(theamericanscholar.org)
79 points | 57 commentspage 2
cm2012 2 days ago|
Jack Kerouac was quite misogynistic in real life and this unfortunately comes through in his work. Makes it hard to read.
kerabatsos 2 days ago||
Many great authors are deeply flawed people. Tolstoy was not a good person, and Steinbeck was a complete a-hole. The list is long. But the classics they create are no less classic.

https://www.the-independent.com/arts-entertainment/books/fea...

https://www.rbth.com/history/330411-why-leo-tolstoy-was-terr...

lukan 2 days ago|||
"Tolstoy was not a good person"

Because he did not cheat on his wife, like it was common, but told her from the beginning, that he is not monogamous and she should make up her mind, whether she can accept that?

That is not a flaw in my book.

And that he left household chores to her?

Well, depends how things were agreed between them, but since his dayjob was writing .. I think that article overall presents a very weak case.

watwut 2 days ago||
> And that he left household chores to her?

"all this was also on Sophia’s shoulders, including the village’s clinic, which she paid to organize. Last but not the least, Sophia was her husband’s scribe, secretary and literary agent. She even consulted Anna Dostoevsky, another great writer’s wife who was responsible for her husband’s literary business. Sophia understood the perplexing handwriting of her husband and rewrote and edited many of his works. She copied the entire text of War and Peace seven times."

Household chores is massively underselling it. Like common, give her credit for everything she had done, which was quite a lot more then just household chores.

> Because he did not cheat on his wife, like it was common, but told her from the beginning

She was 18, he was 34 and he gave her his diaries with all the details to read. And he in fact broke the promisses he gave to wife (not to cheat with women in the village).

Overall he does come across as a low key asshole even if we ignore cheating as a fair play.

lukan 2 days ago||
"Household chores is massively underselling it. Like common, give her credit for everything she had done, which was quite a lot more then just household chores."

Like I said, it depends on the agreements they had. I have no problem giving her credit, my question was whether it makes Tolstoy bad.

"And he in fact broke the promisses he gave to wife (not to cheat with women in the village)."

That would be bad, but is that a solid fact?

edit:

"not to have any women in our village, except for rare chances, which I would neither seek nor prevent"

That is the quote from the article. Does not imply he broke it to me.

kakacik 2 days ago||
Whats your problem grasping straws? The guy cheated his wife, plain and simple, even written in your own words. No defensible moral ground I can see.

Maybe you are fine with occasional cheat, maybe your subconsciousness desperately irons out wrinkles of reality to make looking in the mirror still a pleasant activity (like all other people doing bad things who are not complete sociopaths), who cares.

Its failure in one of most important aspect of life, undefendable, and generally looked down upon. Thats it.

lukan 2 days ago||
Cheating implies lying and breaking agreements and I did not write that about Tolstoy. I see no cheating, if the agreements were made upfront in a different way. And no promises broken from Tolstoy as far as I know. With even sharing his diary, he seemed to be have been crystal clear and open about everything from the start, or do you have different information?

What promises and agreements he did break?

watwut 2 days ago|||
But it is ok to say where their general opinions and attitudes visibly reflect in their books. We do not have to pretend those aspects done exist.

And it is also ok how sometimes, or even not frequently, misogynistic content makes you look cool to quite a lot of people.

dyauspitr 1 day ago||
Misogyny in the past and in the recent current haven’t been moral failings.
douglasgloria 1 day ago||
[dead]
zbyforgotp 2 days ago|
Destroying high trust society is a lot of fun.
dang 1 day ago||
OK, but please don't post unsubstantive comments to Hacker News.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

GlibMonkeyDeath 2 days ago|||
A concise 9 word summary of OTR. As a young person, I found the idea of just running around with your friends, doing whatever, and not trying to be "productive" in any way, intoxicating.

After I got a little older, though, I identified more with people left in the wake of destruction (e.g., the guy who owned the new car they were driving across the country for delivery.)

dyauspitr 1 day ago||
We’re done with that, the GOP is now having fun destroying the medium trust society.