Top
Best
New

Posted by all-along 12/22/2025

Debian's Git Transition(diziet.dreamwidth.org)
256 points | 147 commentspage 2
gorgoiler 12/23/2025|
Forge != repository is a good design pattern. If the two are separate you can even use multiple forges per repository.

Perhaps you might host hardware designs or art assets that benefit from one kind of forge, alongside code that benefits from another? Or more simply use one forge for CI and another for code review.

hu3 12/22/2025||
https://archive.ph/vp6rp
jancsika 12/22/2025||
> The canonical git format is “patches applied”.

How many Debian packages have patches applied to upstream?

rurban 12/22/2025||
Most, because Debian is the only distro which strictly enforces their manpages and filesystem standards. And most source packages don't care much, resp. have other ideas
dima55 12/22/2025|||
Lots. Because many upstream projects don't have their build system set up to work within a distribution (to get dependencies form the system and to install to standard places). All distros must patch things to get them to work.
latchup 12/22/2025||
Well, there are big differences in how aggressively things are patched. Arch Linux makes a point to strictly minimize patches and avoid them entirely whenever possible. That's a good thing, because otherwise, nonsense like the Xscreensaver situation ensues, where the original developers aggressively reject distro packages for mutilating their work and/or forcing old and buggy versions on unsuspecting users.
dima55 12/22/2025|||
Huh? I contribute to Debian; I don't aggressively patch anything. You can too.
lionkor 12/22/2025|||
It's "let's patch as little as possible" vs "let's enforce our rules with the smallest patch possible"
latchup 12/23/2025|||
Well good for you. Then I suppose you don't speak for the Debian maintainers responsible for trainwrecks like this:

https://research.swtch.com/openssl

There seems to be a serious issue with Debian (and by extension, the tens of distros based on it) having no respect whatsoever for the developers of the software their OS is based on, which ends up hurting users the most. Not sure why they cannot just be respectful, but I am afraid they are shoveling Debian's grave, as people are abandoning stale and broken Debian-based distros in droves.

lelanthran 12/23/2025|||
> nonsense like the Xscreensaver situation ensues, where the original developers aggressively reject distro packages

I didn't know about this. Link?

latchup 12/23/2025||
https://www.jwz.org/blog/2016/04/i-would-like-debian-to-stop...

and

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=819703#158

Needless to say, Zawinski was more than a little frustrated with how the Debian maintainers do things.

But honestly, this took 30 seconds to Google and was highly publicized at the time. This whole "I never heard of this, link??" approach to defend a lost argument when the point made is easily verifiable serves to do nothing but detract from discussion. Which, you know, is what this place is for.

lelanthran 12/23/2025||
I wasn't defending anything; searching for xscreensaver debian debacle yielded links that might or might not have been what you were referring to, They did not, however, yield a link to the JWZ site.

I genuinely wanted to know what this was about.

dspillett 12/22/2025||
A fair few I expect, amongst actively developed apps/utils/libs. Away from sid (unstable) Debian packages are often a bit behind upstream but still supported, so security fixes are often back-ported if the upstream project isn't also maintaining older releases that happen to match the version(s) in testing/stable/oldstable.
shevy-java 12/22/2025||
Debian is kind of slow in adapting to the modern world.

I kind of appreciate that debian put FOSS at a core value very early on; in fact, it was the first distribution I used that forced me to learn the commandline. The xorg-server or rather X11 server back then was not working so I only had the commandline, and a lean debian handbook. I typed in the commands and learned from that. Before this I had SUSE and it had a much thicker book, with a fancypants GUI - and it was utterly useless. But that was in 2005 or so.

Now, in 2025, I have not used debian or any debian based distribution in a long time. I either compile from source loosely inspired by LFS/BLFS; or I may use Manjaro typically these days, simply because it is the closest to a modern slackware variant (despite systemd; slackware I used for a long time, but sadly it slowed down too much in the last 10 years, even with modern variants such as alienbob's slackware variant - manjaro moves forward like 100x faster and it also works at the same time, including when I want to compile from source; for some reason, many older distributions failed to adapt to the modern era. Systemd may be one barrier here, but the issue is much more fundamental than that. For instance, you have many more packages now, and many things take longer to compile, e. g. LLVM and what not, which in turn is needed for mesa, then we have cmake, meson/ninja and so forth. A lot more software to handle nowadays).

IshKebab 12/22/2025|
> Debian is kind of slow in adapting to the modern world.

Yeah definitely. I guess this is a result of their weird idea that they have to own the entire world. Every bit of open source Linux software ever made must be in Debian.

If you have to upgrade the entire world it's going to take a while...

rilindo 12/22/2025||
I always thought that Debian is already on git, so this confused me. How is source control currently (or was) done with the Debian project?
Sesse__ 12/22/2025|
The short answer is that it's not.

The longer answer is that a lot of people already use Git for Debian version control, and the article expands on how this will be better-integrated in the future. But what goes into the archive (for building) is fundamentally just a source package with a version number. There's a changelog, but you're free to lie in it if you so wish.

trebligdivad 12/22/2025||
This is great; I hate fighting distro source tools when I want to debug something.
throwaway7356 12/22/2025|
This just adds a new tool though.

Obligatory XKCD reference: https://xkcd.com/927/

danudey 12/22/2025||
New tools during the transition, hopefully fewer tools in the long run. Also things making a lot more sense in the long run.
cylemons 12/23/2025|
How do derivatives like Ubuntu build their packages compared to Debian?