Posted by soypat 7 hours ago
It is heathwarming to see such mundane small tech bit making front page of HN when elsewhere is is debated whether programming as profession is dead or more broadly if AI will be enslaving humanity in the next decade. :)
If you’re tired of talking about AI, why did you post this?
In the past few weeks I've started opening neovim again and just writing code. It's still 50/50 with a Claude code instance, but fuck I don't feel a big productivity difference.
But we're still required to go to the office, and talking to a computer on the open space is highly unwelcome
This is the same thing as picking a new smart programming language or package, or insisting that Dvorak layout is the only real way forward.
Personally I try to put as much distance to the modality discussion and get intimate with the substance.
a = 1
assert a == 1
// many lines here where a is never used
assert a == 1
Yes AI test cases are awesome until you read what it's doing.
Especially when folks are trying to push % based test metrics and have types ( and thus they tests assert types where the types can't really be wrong ).
I use AI to write tests. Many of them the e2e fell into the pointless niche, but I was able to scope my API tests well enough to get very high hit rate.
The value of said API tests aren't unlimited. If I had to hand roll them, I'm not sure I would have written as many, but they test a multitude of 400, 401, 402, 403, and 404s, and the tests themselves have absolutely caught issues such as validator not mounting correctly, or the wrong error status code due to check ordering.
Interesting comment, since v4 is the only version that provides the maximal random bits and is recommended for use as a primary key for non-correlated rows in several distributed databases to counter hot-spotting and privacy issues.
If the library just existed as a correct implementation of the RFC and without bugs, and there was no need to fix stuff, that would be one thing. But leaving features and bug fixes already committed to the repository unreleased for years because the maintainer hasn't cut a new release since 2024 is a bad sign.
This is an example of an unmaintained UUID library in a similar situation that is currently causing incompatibilities because they implemented the draft spec. and didn’t update when the RFC changed:
https://github.com/stevesimmons/uuid7/issues/1
Any Python developer using the uuid7 library is getting something that is incompatible with the UUIDv7 specification and other UUIDv7 implementations as a result. Developers who use the stdlib uuid package in Python 3.14+ and uuid7 as a fallback in older versions are getting different, incompatible behaviour depending upon which version of Python they are running.
This can manifest itself as a developer using UUIDv7 for its time-ordered property, deploying with Python <=3.13, upgrading to Python 3.14+ and discovering that all their data created with Python 3.13 sorts incorrectly when mixed with data created with Python 3.14+.
A UUID library that is not receiving updates is quite possibly badly broken and definitely warrants suspicion and closer inspection.
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc9562/
The problem is not that it is a draft RFC, the problem is that the library is unmaintained with an unresponsive developer who is squatting the uuid7 package name. It’s the top hit for Python developers who want to use UUIDv7 for Python 3.13 and below.
The open issue in Google's repo about the package being malicious is not a good look. The community concluded it's a false positive. If the repo was maintained they'd confirm this and close the issue.
Maintaince is much more than RFC compliance, although the project hasn't met that bar either.
So, it makes sense for Go to introduce support for this as well.
Generally means it'll be going in unless something new comes up which alters people's thinking.
> Would like to point out how Go is rather the exception than the norm with regards to including UUID support in its standard library.
> C#: https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/api/system.guid.new...
> Java: https://docs.oracle.com/javase/8/docs/api/java/util/UUID.htm...
> JavaScript: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/Crypto/rand...
> Python: https://docs.python.org/3/library/uuid.html
> Ruby: https://ruby-doc.org/stdlib-1.9.3/libdoc/securerandom/rdoc/S...
Is C# the language that gives the Go stdlib a run for its money? I haven't used it much. JS, Python, and Ruby, I have, quite a bit, and I have the sprawling requirements.txts and Gemfiles to prove it.
I asked the question I did upthread because, while there are a lot of colorable arguments about what Go did wrong, a complete and practical standard library where the standard library's functionality is the idiomatic answer to the problems it addresses is one of the things Go happens to do distinctively well. Which makes dunking on it for this UUID thing kind of odd.
For a short script, the standard "urllib.request" module [0] works pretty well, and is usually my first choice since it's always installed. For a larger program, I'll usually use a third-party module with more features/async support though, but I'll only do this if I'm using other third-party dependencies anyways.
> JS, Python, and Ruby, I have, quite a bit, and I have the sprawling requirements.txts and Gemfiles to prove it.
I checked the top 10 Go repositories on GitHub [1], and all but 1 of them have 30+ direct dependencies listed in their "go.mod" files (and many more indirect ones). Also, both C and JavaScript are well-known for their terrible standard libraries, yet out of all languages, JavaScript programs tend to use the most dependencies, while C programs tend to use the least. So I don't think that the number of dependencies that an average program in a given language uses says anything about the quality of that language's standard library.
Big projects having big dependencies, whoopty fucking do
Go's package management is actually one of its strongest points, so I think that it's unsurprising/good that some projects have lots of dependencies. But I still stand by the point that you shouldn't judge a language based on how many dependencies most programs written in it use.
(Except for JavaScript, where I have no problem judging it by the npm craziness :) )
That's not what happens in Golang.
But lots of programs (and most of the programs that I write) don't use any cryptography, and only have trivial networking requirements, and outside those areas, I'd argue that the Python standard library [0] has broader coverage, supports more features, and is better documented than the Go standard library [1].
The Go standard library is still pretty great though, and is well ahead of most other languages; I just personally think that it's a little worse than Python's. But if you mostly write networking/crypto code, I can easily see how you'd have the opposite opinion.
If you’re arguing as the grandparent did that Go regularly omits important packages from its standard library, then it’s not unreasonable to ask you for your idea of an exemplary stdlib.
For example they've removed asyncore, their original loop-based module before the async/await syntax existed. All the software from that era needs a total rewrite. Luckily in debian for now the module is provided as a .deb package so I didn't have to do the total rewrite.
I understand the defensiveness about implementing new features, and I understand the rationale to keep the core as small as possible. But come on, it's not like UUID is a new thing. As the opener already pointed out, UUID is essential in pretty much all languages for interoperability so it makes sense to have that in the standard language.
Anyways, I'm just happy we'll get generic methods after 10 years of debates, I suppose. Maybe we'll get an export keyword before another 10, too. Then CGo will finally be usable outside a single package without those overlapping autogenerated symbols...
If you want to see go-uniquie highschool debate club, look at Go team attitude to fixing logging, where community proposed multiple ways of solving it, Go team rejected all of them and then made massive navel-gazing post that could be summed up "well, there is multiple proposals THAT MEANS PEOPLE ARE UNSURE ON THE ISSUE so we won't do shit"
...then removed every question related to go logging (that were common in previous ones) in their yearly survey
However I would still advocate for it over C in scenarios easily covered by TinyGo and TamaGo.
The maintainers did the right thing by just saying "no."
UUIDs rarely get new versions. I don’t think it’d be too much to expect Go to stay relatively current on that.
If added, keep the scope small: implement RFC 4122 v4 generation using crypto/rand.Read with correct version and variant bit handling, provide Parse and String, MarshalText and UnmarshalText, JSON Marshal and Unmarshal hooks, and database/sql Scanner and Valuer, and skip v1 MAC and time based generation by default because of privacy and cross-platform headaches.