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Posted by speckx 2 hours ago

I haven't used a mouse for 14 years(axelk.ee)
24 points | 52 comments
mikestew 1 hour ago|
I don't know, does a trackpad count? In one sense, no, it's not a mouse. In which case, I guess I'm in the same boat. I don't know if I even have any mice in the house anymore.

OTOH, I thought this might be a post from a keyboard shortcut wizard.

JoshTriplett 1 hour ago||
I spend most of my time using a ThinkPad laptop touchpad, but the critical property that makes it usable for me is the physical mouse buttons. I find it incredibly awkward to use any system without physical mouse buttons, or any system where tap-to-click has not been disabled.

I tried, on my current laptop, to see if I could get used to having tap-to-click enabled even without actually using it; I wanted to see how far off I was from being able to deal with any non-ThinkPad. I ended up turning it back off after a few days, after many many clicks I didn't want to click.

D13Fd 1 hour ago||
My wife feels the same way as you. I guess everyone is different. To me, tap-to-click and two-finger right click feel the best by far.
vladvasiliu 1 hour ago||
Why do you find this better? I find it awkward to have to contort my hand to hold the button down when dragging around. This was already the case with older trackpads with the buttons below, but now all trackpads with physical buttons I've seen have them above (probably intended for the trackpoint).

I really hate the hinge-style trackpads, but even on macs, I always enable tap to click and double-tap-drap to hold. On mac os and linux you can enable a "persistent hold for a short while" which allows to lift your finger briefly without losing the hold. Never found a similar setting on windows, which drives me crazy whenever I absolutely have to use that os.

JoshTriplett 16 minutes ago||
> This was already the case with older trackpads with the buttons below, but now all trackpads with physical buttons I've seen have them above (probably intended for the trackpoint).

I think they're officially intended for the trackpoint, yes. But I find buttons-above convenient, because if I rest my arm/hand in a relaxed fashion on the laptop palm rest, I can use my pointer or middle finger for precise movement, and click with my middle or ring finger.

That said, I'd take buttons-below over no buttons. With buttons-below, I'm using my middle finger to mouse and my pointer finger to click, and that's still reasonably comfortable.

In both cases, I find it better because: clicking the button requires a deliberate action that won't happen by accident while using the touchpad; there's no delay required to confirm if touching the touchpad is a click something else, it's never a click; there's nothing timing-based at all, motion is motion and clicking is clicking; right-click and middle-click have dedicated buttons (I probably use middle-click many times more often than right-click on any given day, to open links in tabs and to close tabs).

This isn't something that could be solved with a better touchpad or better software.

veilrap 1 hour ago||
I exclusively use trackpads like Magic Trackpad 2 when I'm on MacOS. But I exclusively use a mouse when I'm running Windows and Linux.

MacOS just seems more tailored to the touchpad experience. Windows and Linux more tailored to the mouse experience.

seabrookmx 1 hour ago|
Modern GNOME distros (Ubuntu and Fedora when running Wayland, for example) work pretty well with a trackpad. You get all the usual Mac-style gestures: two finger scrolling, pinch to zoom, three finger horizontal swipe for workspaces, three finger vertical swipe for "expose" style app overview, etc.

I'm running a Framework 13 and other than the physical click requiring more effort than the haptic "click" on a Mac, it's pretty dang similar.

rootusrootus 1 hour ago||
I've tried them all. Trackpad, trackpoint, trackball, all of them. I keep coming back to a mouse. Everything else is either frustrating and finicky, or it induces RSI after a few hours.
thibaut_barrere 1 hour ago||
What worked for me is “logitech lift”, one left handed the other right handed. When they are connected I set up my Mac to disable the trackpad.

That + sport and standing desk, did wonder to me.

drivers99 1 hour ago|||
I detest the trackpad on my Windows (Linux soon) laptop, so I have to use an external mouse with it, but I use the "magic trackpad" on my personal and work macbooks including external ones without issues (except if I have to drag something very far; this three finger drag seems to make it nicer although it wouldn't work if I needed to make sure not to let go like when dragging files around). Just wanted to point out that there's a big difference.
vladvasiliu 1 hour ago||
I don't daily drive a mac anymore, but I seem to remember that it allowed you to hold the selection with one or more fingers, and move another finger on touchpad for the actual moving part. You could lift this last finger without letting go of the selection.
tokai 1 hour ago||
Did you try a mousetrapper?
bee_rider 1 hour ago||
I thought it was going to be about someone who’d fully embraced the terminal.

Preferring a trackpad to a mouse seems not so unusual, right? I guess sticking to it so completely is. I prefer marble-mouse type devices, but I can’t say with any certainty that I haven’t accidentally touched a mouse in the past 14 years.

tejohnso 1 hour ago||
I haven't used a mouse in ages, but I haven't used a trackpad - ever. I've never found one that matches the accuracy, speed, and overall joy of using TrackPoint to move the mouse cursor.
D13Fd 1 hour ago||
Yeah it’s really a shame that the track point wasn’t adopted globally (I’m assuming for patent reasons, but surely any patents must be expired by now).

For years I used a Trackpoint external keyboard plus a mouse. The track point is great for small movements when you’re primarily typing, and the mouse is great for when you are primarily moving the cursor.

nine_k 1 hour ago||
I love trackpoint for navigation and UI control. But it's not that great for drawing / painting (even though I did use it for that, successfully).
Ancapistani 56 minutes ago||
If, like me, you like to script your Mac environment setup, the following two commands SHOULD do the same thing:

    defaults write com.apple.AppleMultitouchTrackpad TrackpadThreeFingerDrag -bool true
    defaults write com.apple.driver.AppleBluetoothMultitouch.trackpad TrackpadThreeFingerDrag -bool true
Unfortunately I've not been able to verify this, as it doesn't take effect until you log out and back in, and I'm in the middle of a task. Once it's done I'll test it and either update this post or comment with my results, depending on how long it takes me.

ETA: I tested it, and the behavior is correct when I log back in after running the above. Oddly though, the settings aren't showing as turned on in the settings panel. If anyone has a scriptable solution to that I'd love to hear it.

themadturk 25 minutes ago||
When I do use a mouse, I use a Logitech Lift because horizontal grip mice are uncomfortable, but now that I've retired and 99% of my time is on my MacBook Air, it's all trackpad, and my hands don't seem to mind it.
kstrauser 1 hour ago||
Wish I could use a trackpad as-is. My wrists are mildly FUBAR after decades of computer work/obsession, and now I'm having to deal with it. For me, that means that continual wrist pronation freaking hurts.

Let your arms hang straight down. Now bend your elbows and lift your forearms so that they're at 90º to your body, i.e. parallel to the ground. Notice that your hands are naturally oriented so that if you were holding a pole, it would be much closer to pointing downward than sideways. Rotating your wrists "inward" so that your hand is parallel to your desk, in the position to use a trackpad, is not their normal position.

I used a magic trackpad for quite a while until I found myself in agony by the end of the day. One of my coworkers told me he was exploring using vertical mice and that caught my attention. I tried one and it stopped the pain, like, immediately. Mousing around was awkward for a few days until I got used to the different hand orientation and movement, but that passed quickly. Now I'd never, ever go back to a trackpad.

I'd considered making a little block to mount my magic trackpad sideways at, say, a 45º angle to my desk so that my wrist wasn't so pronated, but even then it nudges you toward radial and ulnar deviation which can also become uncomfortable over time. I'd rather just painlessly use my vertical mouse which uses forearm movement and write extension/flexion to zip the cursor around my screen.

amarant 1 hour ago|
Sounds like you might benefit from something like the UHK[1].

It's got tenting, which approaches that natural tilt to your hands, and there are several mouse add-ons to choose from, I'm sure one of them will suit your needs.

[1]https://uhk.io/

kstrauser 1 hour ago||
Yeah, something like that is awfully appealing. I don't have as much trouble with typing as with trackpadding for whatever happy combination of reasons, the biggest being that I taught myself to type after playing piano for many years first, and so completely ignored "proper" home-row typing in favor of piano-like "move your hand around and wiggle your fingers" typing. I'm still one of the faster typists I know, so doing it "wrong" hasn't held me back at all.

But. If my hands start to hurt while typing, I'm definitely trying something like that as my first keyboard experiment.

apparent 1 hour ago|
> macOS setup guide used to include an option to turn on three finger drag, but now it has been hidden in the accessibility option.

I don't understand why Apple does this. It's like the "allow ANC with one AirPod" setting, which is also inexplicably an accessibility option.

drivers99 1 hour ago|
Thanks for mentioning that. I have one hearing aid so I've had to take it out so I can wear both AirPods when I want noise cancellation at all with AirPods. (I can also stream to the hearing aid but it is very tinny, completely lacking bass.)
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