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Posted by berlianta 5 days ago

FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs(www.404media.co)
https://archive.is/ZobUQ
585 points | 389 commentspage 3
functionmouse 5 days ago|
does nothing to fight spam; only polices lawful users

they call that "anarcho-tyranny"

tamimio 5 days ago||
I probably said it dozens of times in here, phone numbers are the link between your IRL identity and digital one, that’s why a lot of services still require a phone number to “prevent spam”, yeah right, it’s just to get to you if ever needed.
9cb14c1ec0 5 days ago||
I expect the FCC to adopt this rule, and I also expect it to be challenged in court, on the basis that there are many other approaches to fighting spam calls that the FCC has not tried, but are much less intrusive.
ryanisnan 5 days ago|
I hope you're right. I am not informed - is this typically how these decisions get challenged?
9cb14c1ec0 5 days ago||
There are two ways to challenge FCC decisions. There is the upfront approach where a business whose operations are harmed by an FCC decision sues to block the decision. Then there is the approach where said business announces their non-compliance and dares the FCC to sue them. The FCC does not have criminal charging authority, so it has to rely on courts to enforce compliance. See the Federal Communications Commission v. AT&T case that just wrapped up at the Supreme Court.
atum47 5 days ago||
And phone companies are enabling telecoms by manufacturing devices that don't take physical sim cards anymore. I recently migrate from pixel 8 to 10, it only supports eSim. In order to migrate my sim to an eSim I had to provide voice, image, documents and info of the phone I was installing the eSim on. One of the worse companies in Brazil, Vivo, now have everything about me. I bet they keep it in a big excel file accessible via a secret but public link
sschueller 5 days ago||
This has been the case for a long time in Switzerland. If you want a mobile phone SIM, you need to provide your ID. Of course easy if you have a national ID...

I don't see the issue here and I am surprised that this wasn't the case in the United States.

However since it is now trivial to communicate encrypted with so many other devices, I don't see the point now. This would have been a "good" thing back in the 90'.

ZedZark 5 days ago||
A voluntary model would be nice - what X (more or less) does currently. You can elect to be verified by X, and it will show the badge, or you can opt out and not get the badge, but you can still use it.

If phones could reliably tag an incoming call as "ID provided" or not, then people who cared could screen calls appropriately, and people who wanted to protect their identity could still have a phone.

mrsssnake 5 days ago||
Regardless of this, I see phone network as a legacy thing that in perfect world should already be replaced with lightweight upgradeable calling protocol over IPv6.
fc417fc802 5 days ago||
This would apply equally to said IP calling network since you'd need a SIM card to access the tower interesting strewn across the country either way.
dredmorbius 5 days ago||
WiFi / pure-VOIP based calling should be able to disambiguate between the network and the messaging layers. This means that a given cellular modem wouldn't be traceable to a specific contact, or call history. The modems could be swapped amongst individuals readily.

This is similar to the situation that already exists for PSTN voice comms currently: Whatsapp, Signal, Jitsi, or similar voice- or video-messaging systems. They'll run over an arbitrary network, through VPNs, etc.

Mind, the major comms-apps/social networks might have their own ID requirements forced on them, but there's far less a capability to keep people from defecting from these.

I continue to think that global PSTN networks are pretty close to general collapse, given spam, robocalls, harassment, tracking, and similar forms of abuse. Millennials & GenZ are already notorious for their reluctance to make or take phone calls.

<https://theconversation.com/young-people-hate-making-phone-c...>

danhon 5 days ago||
This is essentially requiring ID for IP connectivity.
loloquwowndueo 5 days ago||
This has been tried in Mexico at least twice - crooks are still finding ways to have burners and smuggle anonymous phones into jails etc.
simulator5g 5 days ago|
It's not about stopping crime, it's about control.
loloquwowndueo 4 days ago||
Sure but that’s not how they’re selling it.
tonetegeatinst 5 days ago||
Pretty sure that this would just encourage privacy minded folks to find a loophole.

Or if you get fed up enough you just start blasting FM transmissions without a license..... Keep the burst short enough while your mobile and don't make the transmitter obvious and you could probably get away with it for short SMS comms.

Or just use something like lora or meshtastic/meshcore

trumpdong 5 days ago|
The loophole is to use a homeless person's ID for $20.

Wait. In the US don't they not even have an ID standard? The homeless person probably doesn't have any valid ID and neither do members of several other disenfranchised groups, right? So now they're not allowed to have cellphone service?

Tangurena2 4 days ago||
Some states allow homeless people to get IDs. Some do not. My state outlawed homelessness in last year's Crime Bill - the charge is now called "unlawful camping" and it outlawed cities from having zones where people are allowed to camp unless they basically create something like a KOA campground (and outlawed using tax money to do so).
c2h5oh 5 days ago|
This is already the case in most (all?) EU countries. Government-issued photo ID is required to activate a SIM card.

If you really need a burner you can still get one - there are people who activate SIM cards in bulk using their ID and resell them without collecting IDs. The practice itself is either gray area legally or straight up illegal depending on the country

hocuspocus 5 days ago|
I was a teenager when Switzerland introduced the mandatory ID check, in 2003 or 2004 iirc.

My carrier added 10 CHF credit to my prepaid plan for the trouble.

It's still fairly easy to buy a Lycamobile SIM/number that was enabled with a fake or stolen ID. Consequently some banks and services ban entire number ranges, which is not only ineffective but also affects people who committed the sin of keeping their first phone number even after moving to a proper postpaid plan...

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