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Posted by tylerdane 16 hours ago

Maybe you should learn something(www.marginalia.nu)
350 points | 168 commentspage 2
connerpocket 4 hours ago|
This resonated with me, although my experience has been a little different.

I started playing pool in college around 2017 and, without really intending to, it became something I did at least once a week. I never had a structured practice routine or any goal of getting really good. I just enjoyed playing, and after enough years I realized I'd become a decent player.

I never gambled, but we usually played loser-pays, so every session still cost a bit. I'm unemployed right now, so I've stopped going because it just doesn't fit my budget anymore.

khurs 8 hours ago||
The education system is to blame.

Kids are conditioned to associate learning with a formal course with a tutor culminating in exams.

It's also intentional to segregate skills, if schools taught every child basic plumbing or car mechanics for example instead of spending a month teaching something that won't get used in life, there would be less job in those fields.

SoftTalker 4 hours ago||
So there's a conspiracy between plumbers, mechanics, and public schools to not teach basic handyman skills to the students?

We used to have "shop" (or similarly named) classes for this in junior high/middle school. They have mostly been cut, but more for budgetary reasons. A lot of high schools still have a vocational department for the kids who are not college-bound and not complete wasteoids.

khurs 4 hours ago||
I'm not in USA, so can't speak for you. But here in UK it is accepted that schools were, and remain, designed to produce well behaved consumers and workers.
sanderjd 5 hours ago||
"I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."
ronbenton 8 hours ago||
One “trick” nowadays is to just do a thing for the sake of doing the thing. I draw. Not to post my drawings to social media, not to try to get income from paid commissions, but rather just to enjoy the act of drawing. It’s very liberating in a world where it feels like almost everything has to be in service of some kind of larger scheme.
LatencyKills 8 hours ago|
I retired a few years ago and now do a slew of things (photography, robotics, 3D printing, etc.) entirely for myself. I'll start a project, have a blast learning/building, then simply move on to the next thing.

Learning for the sake of learning is one of my favorite things in life.

andrew_lettuce 7 hours ago||
Not finishing - or even being able to define the finish line - is a great sign you're doing this right. You're not a tortoise seeking mastery; it's ok to be a distracted hare!
CalRobert 13 hours ago||
"have infants ricocheting around your home like screaming DVD logos, then you may want to put this ambition aside for now and deal with that instead"

Even older kids... my 6 year old is jumping on the couch as I type this..

I like remote work but when I had to commute it was really nice to have that downtime built in to the day. I learned a lot of Dutch vocabulary on the train.

asp_hornet 10 hours ago||
Don’t be fooled, the first few years you get spoiled with “the first moments” of things. Then suddenly the “last moments” start creeping in, “the last nappy”, “the last car seat”, at first they seem like a god send but then they accumulate like an avalanche.

One day you will pick them up and, and most likely neither of you will know it, but it will be the last time you ever do.

Treasure everything, even the insanity.

sarchertech 8 hours ago||
I plan to keep lifting my kids everyday like Milo. Hopefully I can push off the last time I pick them up till they’re 30 or so.
swat535 2 hours ago||
At 30, they'll probably be picking you up instead, I'm 37, grown too strong and easily lift my dad lol
hahahaa 12 hours ago|||
The hobby can be with the kid! E.g. go out on a kayak with them (safety first etc.) or learn to coach sport.
HexPhantom 12 hours ago||
That's probably the sweet spot
HexPhantom 12 hours ago|||
There's something useful about time that is already spoken for. You're on the train, you can't do much else, so learning some Dutch feels easy. At home the same half hour somehow gets fragmented into six different things
abc123abc123 9 hours ago||
Children are not god for peace of mind and a life of liberty. I do not recommend anyone to have children, becaues of how negatively it affects your life, cost of living etc. It is basically just tying yourself down to the wheel of consumption, and in order to jutsify everything, all the struggle, push your hopes and aspirations to the next generation, and then letting them deal with it.

If you are rich, you can get around this by hiring people to take care of the children, so then it could be possible, but it will still be a huge financial burden.

philangist 8 hours ago|||
This comment actually triggered something in me and I wanted to write a dismissive and condescending response but in the spirit of HN I’d like to try a different approach.

I’ve honestly never been able to understand this kind of thinking (uniformly ruling children as a negative because of the downsides), but I’d be curious to understand more about your perspective.

How do you weigh the joy and meaning many people find in having a family against the economic and time freedom costs?

Or the fact that societies do need to continue having children in order to: sustain economic growth, service their elderly population (that will be us in a few years to decades), maintain their armed forces, perpetuate their culture and values into the future, invest in scientific research, etc.

Are these not things you value? Or do you just see the tradeoff as not worth it?

CalRobert 1 hour ago||||
You’re correct about peace of mind (I’ve never been more afraid than I have been for my kids) and liberty (modern parenting is akin to house arrest at times) but the fact remains I never knew I could love someone as much as I love my kids, and I’m richer for it.
kannanvijayan 6 hours ago||||
Having a child was a profoundly selfish act for me. I wanted one because I can't imagine any challenge more fascinating and rewarding (for me) than raising a child.

I don't understand what the point of hiring people to take care of mine would be. That's the fun part. Makes about as much sense as going to an amusement park and paying someone to take the rides for you.

ndriscoll 5 hours ago||||
Children don't necessitate a consumption spiral. The fact that they grow so quickly means there's plenty of cheaply available used items (clothes, books, toys, etc.). If you have multiple, or if they have cousins, then there's also hand-me-downs. Then there's free stuff like parks or libraries, or e.g. our county has a nearby recreation center with a splash pad.

We did buy a more expensive home to live near better peers, but that's not really a consumption issue; it's a cultural one.

andrew_lettuce 7 hours ago||||
The fact that you need to fight an incredibly strong biological motivator to do this suggests you're wrong. If you have a builder mentality and want to leave the world better than you found it, having kids is the best path. They're also my retirement plan.
dofm 4 hours ago||||
I will now never be a parent, but what are you suggesting people preserve their money for if not consumption?
stevetron 2 hours ago||
what money?
rpdillon 8 hours ago|||
How many children do you have?
noisy_boy 4 hours ago||
Because this seems like an appropriate topic/place to ask, are there say 20 books on a variety of topics that one can say are very useful to build a foundation of our world, in the physical and metaphorical sense? Literature probably shouldn't be in that list because literature is just a universe of its own and a lot of it is just not that accessible. E.g. I am not knowledgeable enough to be able to read Mahabharata or Odyssey in the original language.
jschveibinz 5 hours ago||
I went back to school in my 50's to learn how to teach. Two of the most important takeaways from that experience were:

1) learning how to learn; and

2) using projects to learn

Writing about your experience in learning is also a powerful tool. If you can describe it to your journal (or someone else), you really know it.

dofm 4 hours ago|
What did you study, specifically? This is the life transition I am considering (and at a similar age).

Did you do a teaching degree or equivalent, or something a bit more theoretical/philosophical?

And who do you now teach?

ubj 3 hours ago||
> and/or have infants ricocheting around your home like screaming DVD logos

Slightly off topic, but as a parent I found this hilarious and will now be closely watching to see if any of my own screaming logos ever perfectly hit the corner of a room.

yetkin 10 hours ago||
I cannot deny the value of learning but there is a fact that learning can be a way of procrastination. This happens when the joy of learning overtake and diverge you from a goal. Nothing wrong about it, it is a time well spent. But I think there must be a balance as well
abalashov 6 hours ago||
The only way I ever learned anything or built anything of value (one of those things still accounts for most of my revenue, 10-15 years later) was by blowing off doing what I was supposed to be doing at that moment, in the classic sense described by PG here:

https://www.paulgraham.com/procrastination.html

(Except, his essay insinuates that there is some kind of brilliance at work here. In my own case, that remains to be seen.)

Never have I ever managed to accomplish anything of merit by just heading straight for it in the plainspoken sense. Some people will say that provides the basic architecture of some kind of "diagnosis", but I think it's just a normal human variance.

andrew_lettuce 7 hours ago|||
Learning can be the goal if you're lucky. Maybe sharing your learning is the next step and that's enough too. You don't need to apply it to something someone defines as "worthy" for validation.
xandrius 8 hours ago|||
Learning is not just strictly studying.

I'd say most of the learning is done by actually doing.

raincole 10 hours ago||
"Sometimes I feel like I'm an athlete who trained all day for years, then before my first professional match, I retired and went off to teach PE."
sanderjd 5 hours ago||
Is this a quote from something?
Ugvx 10 hours ago||
I came to a similar conclusion last weekend. My 20 year old car was having some issues and instead of taking g it to the mechanic to be charged $1,000, thought I would give it a try myself. 3 hours later and the problem was fixed. And I learned a lot in the process.
culebron21 3 hours ago||
That's why I do all DIY myself, incliding plumbing or electrics. Craftsmen cost money and they try to finish in one session, so they do lots of compromises.

Examples: under a sink, there were two 2m-long supply hoses, where 40cm would be enough, convoluted in a double loop together, to spare a visit to a DIY store. Or dowels made to be driven by hammer, for plastic baseboards, used to hang a cupboard (almost fell out). Or a too long corrugated plastic tube making a virage and another, unnecessary, water seal, and impeding outflux -- also to spare a visit to a store.

andrew_lettuce 7 hours ago|||
YouTube has been a godsend for these types of problems. It's like LLM output, you need to validate and cross reference but combined with other sources of information, easy purchase of parts and problems that actually have solutions (vs "buy a new one") I've saved thousands on cars, appliances and home repairs
bartvk 10 hours ago||
I had the same with my motorcycle. Every time I brought it to the dealer, they came up enthusiastically with things to spend money on. Your tires are done! Your break pads are gone! With the help of a friend, I got into doing (very) basic maintenance myself. I just replaced the tires. I fixed a problem with the electrical system. And next will be the chain and sprocket.
wavemode 4 hours ago|
The key is to find something that you enjoy sucking at. I recently picked up quad rollerskating and the process of getting steadier and smoother at it (while just enjoying the vibes, music and community at my local rink) has become an obsession. It's my new third-favorite hobby (after programming and competitive cornhole).
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