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Posted by chipweinberger 1 day ago

What I learned selling 2,500 MIDI recorders: Hardware is not so hard(chipweinberger.com)
522 points | 237 commentspage 2
chipweinberger 1 day ago|
I'll be sticking around in the comments so feel free to ask questions. AMA!
shizcakes 1 day ago||
What are some examples of good anti-counterfeit strategies? And, if you’re comfortable, which applied for JamCorder?
etrautmann 1 day ago||
+1
rwmj 1 day ago|||
The number that stuck out was 200K lines of code. Can you expand on why so much code had to be written and which parts were the longest (time and/or code) and hardest bits?
chipweinberger 1 day ago||
The app is about 85K lines: device connectivity, first-time setup, syncing, MIDI playback and visualization, library management, audio/video export, and OTA workflows.

The firmware is about 110K lines: MIDI recording + streaming, USB, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, web APIs, storage, OTA updates, diagnostics, security, peripherals, provisioning, and an embedded web interface.

There’s a lot required to make a full-featured product.

lukeweston1234 1 day ago|||
This seems like an incredibly large codebase. Did you use an existing RTOS or something similar for this product, or was this all hand rolled?
bonzini 1 day ago||||
What is the manufacturing tooling that you mention?
chipweinberger 1 day ago||
3 main components: flashing, provisioning keys, hardware testing.

Nearly every component gets tested: sdcard, clock, battery, anti-counterfeit IC, led, buzzer, the tactile-switch!

junon 1 day ago|||
Yeesh, please tell me you didn't write all of that yourself. Which uC is it targeting, and which language?
cazum 1 day ago||
From the photo in the link it looks like he's using an esp32-s3.

I suspect that 110k number might include the ESP-IDF libraries as well as his own code.

I've written a fairly feature-complete handheld device based on the esp32-s2 and the codebase is about 9k sloc of the C I've written, but that number explodes to almost 40k sloc if I include the esp-idf's imported libraries.

chipweinberger 1 day ago||
These numbers do not include ESP-IDF :)
msandford 1 day ago|||
I recognize the "esp32 perched on top of a circuit board" from the picture. I've got a couple of those at my house right now, I'm on the second version of one board and the third of another. I think I'm going down a very similar road for a different product. Would you be willing to some paid advising? I'm an EE so I don't need hand-holding on the actual boards or programming, really just looking for more information on everything else around the edges. Either way, thanks for the article. It was nice to get some validation of my development process.
iamflimflam1 1 day ago||
I can/try to give you some advice if you need - email is in my bio. I did a semi successful CrowdSupply project based around the ESP32S3.
discordance 1 day ago|||
Really cool project. As someone from the software side who is just getting into hardware, this is very inspiring!

How did you find customers?

How did you get your hardware design verified?

hasbot 1 day ago|||
Have you considered supporting other MIDI instruments like e-drums and pad controllers?
chipweinberger 1 day ago||
They should just work! You can replace the soundfont that the app uses with your own too.
8bitsrule 1 day ago|||
Interested. I got far emough on the site to have a couple of questions. (Maybe the answers are on the site?)

1) Does device record ALL MIDI sent to it? (Including e.g. SYSEX and non-registered parameters?

2) I edit MIDI on a Desktop (NOT a phone). a) Are sessions recorded into separate files? Named and/or dated? b) Can I inspect & load sessions from the card?

raphman 1 day ago|||
The website gives a very nice and captivating intro to the device.

But why do you spell MIDI in lowercase there?

> plugs into your piano via midi

chipweinberger 1 day ago||
The marketing answer: all lower-case looks modern and opinionated

The real answer: I got tired of deciding what should and shouldn't be capitalized. Sounds easy but it gets ambiguous fast.

I'll revisit this decision at some point. Capital letters do make reading easier.

lifeisstillgood 1 day ago|||
>>> Have a strong anti-counterfeit strategy. Don’t overlook this.

Can you expand? What counterfeits do you see (literally someone selling boxes labelled jamcorder? How do you handle that? Lots of scanning amazon and sending cease desist letter?

logifail 1 day ago||
Is the app Apple-only?
chipweinberger 1 day ago||
Android too! Built with Flutter. Flutter is great highly recommend it.
aleph-z 22 hours ago||
Congrats! Happy for your success. Your mix of ingredients is impressive (the hardware alone is probably simple). Your product idea came from actual personal need (validation!), and you are able to tie the hardware to your software to widen the moat -- which is great.

Your anti-counterfeiting tech hopefully / probably prevents your Chinese manufacturers / suppliers / related entities from free-riding on your work. (If your volumes start hitting say 50K+, things may change, you may be entering dangerous territory then, so I'd suggest you spend some time on beefing up the moat).

Good luck towards 10K volume!

SunboX 18 hours ago||
Hardware is hard! Because of certifications and organizations like the WEEE. There are many different acts for electronic devices world wide. In Germany you have to spend about $ 20k per month even if you did not ship any product yet - just for regulations, certificates and things you have to register for to be able to sell a electronic device.

That makes hardware hard! The manufacturing and packaging is the easy part.

dimatura 1 day ago||
I think "hardware is as hard as you make it" would've been a better title. The author made the smart decision of keeping things very simple on the hardware side, and that happened to be possible for the kind of product he wanted to make.

Interestingly I've heard a very similar story and sentiment about hardware vs software from another single-person maker (also a software engineer by trade) of a hardware product, also in the music space. And this one was comparatively a more complex product on the hardware side, and did face some supply challenges during covid and tariffs, forcing at least one redesign and price raise. But in both cases, I'd say they made smart choices about keeping the hardware simple. By not pushing the envelope on that front they gave themselves the freedom to invest a lot of time and effort into the software. But not every hardware product is like that (which the author also does acknowledge).

BloodyIron 1 day ago||
How did you market it? I'm trying to get into my own production stuff and I don't want to participate in the parasitic Amazon or overcrowded Etsy ecosystems. Looks like you're doing sales through your own website, which I want to do myself. But I haven't yet figured out how to bring legit traffic to my own website. I don't have money to throw at advertising and that's a minefield of fake traffic anyways. Any advice to share please?
mietek 1 day ago||
> Have a strong anti-counterfeit strategy. Don’t overlook this.

Would like to see this highly non-obvious point expanded upon.

iamjackg 1 day ago||
Long time customer! I bought one after your original post on HN. Congrats on the milestone. Honestly, it's such a good product and I'm such a bad and inconsistent piano player that I completely forget it exists for months at a time. Then I remember about it, open the app, and everything is there: my attempt to figure out a song, my kids smashing the keys as hard as they can, my cat walking across the keyboard. It's such a joy.
jimcollinswort1 1 day ago||
I've had a Jamcorder for 2 years on my digital piano, have been learning to play. Love the tracking data on the calendar and playback. I plugged it in and it's been running and updating itself perfectly the entire time. Thanks so much Chris

Part of the reason I wanted this in the first place was to have the data, a few hundred hours of all my learning and playing. At some point I or someone else will start thowing all this midi into an LLM.the jamcorder has been saving everything I've played in a very tiny amount of space with no effort by me, ultimately will be even more useful.

dmd 1 day ago||
I've been using an Anatek Pocket Record for the past 34 years. Bought it when I was 14. That's value!

https://www.izcorp.com/wp-content/uploads/pm_Pocket-Record.j...

chipweinberger 1 day ago|
Yes I've seen a few people mention that! All of the best MIDI hardware recorders are ancient, for whatever reason. Well, apart from Jamcorder ;)
hoppp 1 day ago|
The audio hardware industry is much more easy due to the gear addict people buying up everything.
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