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Posted by andros 1 day ago

I added a real-time chat to my blog, people used it to attack me(en.andros.dev)
68 points | 99 comments
zetanor 1 day ago|
Talking about this like there's an "attack" feels very melodramatic. It seems to me like the non-constructive messages are either shitposts or just curious probes (testing whether certain codepoints make it through, testing whether bad no-no words make it through, testing how various things will render, testing whether the input is sanitized...). There's links to God knows what and some walls of inflammatory language, but I'm not noticing anything that could even remotely cause any harm.
saaaaaam 1 day ago||
It’s a blog post written by AI. AI makes everything ponderously dramatic.
verzali 1 day ago||
That explains the opening line:

>Sometimes the most irrelevant piece of a project becomes its absolute protagonist.

FatalLogic 1 day ago||
That looks more like a very bad overly-literal translation of Spanish 'protagonista absoluto'. AI generated English would not probably use a phrase which doesn't normally happen in English.

'Main focus' would be better in this situation

saaaaaam 1 day ago||
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egypturnash 1 day ago||
The chat is still there in the corner of this post, with people typing nasty shit into it.

Well have fun delving into programmatic censorship I guess. Or just take it out. If you take the former path and post about trying to fix it here then I'm sure you'll get a lot more free testing of your attempts to enforce civility through regex or whatever. Enjoy learning about the Scunthorpe problem.

hliyan 1 day ago||
Looking at the last few minutes of messages, I get the feeling that all it takes is a handful of motivated (i.e. jobless) malicious individuals to make an entire community or a corner of the Internet look like it has devolved into barbarism.
dpkirchner 1 day ago|||
By my recollection the devolution started around 30 years ago.
schaefer 1 day ago||
Suspiciously close to the birth of the modern internet?
saulpw 1 day ago||
That's not suspicious, that's the load-bearing smoking gun.
mannanj 1 day ago|||
Isn't that always how corruption/devolution has worked? Why not use the same tools we always had: accountability via transparency and then if needed shaming.

Don't want strangers to abuse your resources and community and hide being anonymous to avoid accountability? Adjust/tune that aspect of your community - why can't you be creative and try to solve the problem with ideas like how tribes and organisms deal with this in person.

maybe we can evolve chat interfaces for this obvious low-cost-noise age. Increase the cost somehow, not saying I know how, but it is definitely possible to filter out noise by being creative. edit: stay tuned and I'll probably figure out some solutions.

9Ljdg6p8ZSzejt 1 day ago|||
When I checked it out, the chat was a cesspool of racism, zionism, and horny dudes. Occasionally cool fish emojis.
cestith 1 day ago||
Right now there’s some minor probing, trying to get the site to print variables. There’s racism against Blacks. There’s antisemitism. There are a few people actually trying to say hi to one another. Then there’s a bot that replies to absolutely everyone and invites them to their gay male Chaturbate channel.
9Ljdg6p8ZSzejt 1 day ago||
Looked like people were trying to command inject the bot. Seemed to work a bit too
cyanydeez 19 hours ago|||
alternate title: "I just discovered people are horrendous on the internet"
barbazoo 1 day ago||
Neuralink will hopefully filter that out client side /s

If your audience is more than a handful of people, what's the purpose of chat?

stronglikedan 1 day ago||
To get the handful of people to collaborate and hopefully bring their friends. It's currently at 160 and climbing, no longer a handful, so it seems to be working.
barbazoo 1 day ago|||
What I mean is that I get the purpose of chat when the target audience is a small group of people that might have a reason to talk to each other.
brabel 1 day ago|||
The counter seems broken. It jumps from 100 to 250 then back down to 120. It did that a few times while I was reading.
dylan604 1 day ago||
From the earliest days of websites allowing text input from users, this has been a thing. The same with any website that allows you to draw things, it will quickly show people drawing crude (in content not skill) objects. This is just human nature. Once people realized you could use these forms as attack vectors, we were off to the races. Now that bots can do it for you, I'd only imagine the time before first bot using the form is in minutes. I have seen all sorts of things suggested as workarounds to mitigate bot form submissions, but eventually, you will be spammed at the least with the feature. Adding something like a bot chat, of course people are going to be abusive to it much more than a simple form field.

For someone to be surprised by this today suggests to me that the person is really really new to managing a website.

dillutedfixer 1 day ago|
Exactly. I remember a website from the late 90s that let anonymous users control an LED sign in some shopping mall in Japan. More often than not there were things like swastikas and penises on the board. This type of behavior is nothing new, unfortunately.
dylan604 1 day ago||
Did these LED controls actually control lights or did they just switch out images?
dillutedfixer 1 day ago||
It controlled lights. IIRC there was a grid of squares on the website that you could click on to turn specific lights on or off. There was a webcam pointed at the sign that refreshed every few seconds so you could see the changes. I remember the sign being right above an escalator.
alnwlsn 1 day ago||
I've done this to myself too. I once had a thermal receipt printer I wasn't using, so I decided to point a webcam at it and put it on a webpage so anyone could print random crap to it (it's actually still up - alnwlsn.com/printer). Of course I went in knowing full well what I was getting into, and the types of messages posted to it are about what you expect and get here. Some highlights:

- It was once found by one of those worse-than-4chan places, who spent about 4 hours spamming the worst things you could imagine until it ran out of paper. I added some filtering after that to stop tons of duplicate messages from wasting so much paper and some regex, which reduced the volume of some particularly vile things. Some people do post nice messages too.

- The setup breaks often. Eventually, I'll notice and fix it, but it might have been broken for months. Inevitibly, there will be people using it again within days, with no announcement made. How enough people find it on this tiny corner of the internet is a mystery to me, but they do. I am convinced most of them are real people, because why even bother to point a bot at it?

The whole point was that I thought it would be more interesting than letting the thing sit around on a shelf, and to use up the box of rolls that came with it instead of throwing the whole thing in the trash. Intersting it is; I don't think I would describe it as plesant, but it is interesting.

JSR_FDED 1 day ago||
I’d suggest one additional heuristic: once your bad word detector has triggered, shut down the chat for 10 minutes. That way waves of assholes don’t monopolize the chat, and when they move on to the next target the functionality returns to your site automatically.
operation_moose 1 day ago||
Great way to get someone to create a bot that swears in the chat every 10 minutes and 1 second to permanently shut it down.
phoghed 1 day ago||
But then one asshole can denial of service your chat very easily
dylan604 1 day ago||
Yeah, shutting down to that specific browser fingerprint would be the better way. Sometimes, being able to recognize a user has it's benefits for good /s
lesostep 1 day ago|||
Or just drop websocket connection to them.

Refreshing pages to establish connection again is semi easy for someone who made a honest mistake (and Could make them more cautious), but if someone wants to trigger web-socket disconnect all the time, it would become cumbersome.

Add something like fail2ban, and you're set enough against passing trollers, but not interesting enough to draw attention from people that like the challenge.

Retr0id 1 day ago|||
But don't let them know they've been shut down, use a shadowban.
nickthegreek 1 day ago|||
Agreed. I'd just have 2 chat pools, once you break rules, you get moved to the rule breaker pool with the other like minded individuals. Well behaved individuals wouldn't even know or care about the separation.
effseven 1 day ago|||
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fl4regun 1 day ago||
I'm mostly curious why anyone would bother with doing attacks like this to some random individuals personal blog, was it one person or multiple people? What was the motivation? Is it just bots crawling the internet to spread hate?

A sad state of affairs, but certainly seems like having a strictly moderated comment section is a better option for a site like this.

SoftTalker 1 day ago|
Bored kids. Bots. And scammers/spammers. On the scale of the internet, there are a lot of all of these.

Same reason any blank wall in a city will soon be covered in graffiti.

elcritch 1 day ago||
Reminds me of Maria Abramovic Rythym 0 performance art.

1: https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2023/3/30/maria-abramovic...

artur_makly 1 day ago|
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throwawayffffas 1 day ago||
The obvious solution is shutting it down it does offer nothing.

Short of that shadow ban everyone everyone sees their own messages, and add a few fake ones every now and then.

netsharc 1 day ago|
Hah, or burn lots of GPU cycles for an LLM-enhanced echo-chamber of one... (For each troll an echo chamber/an LLM troll responder)
skygazer 1 day ago||
Like an idiot, I once wrote a simple, internal, in memory chat room via web page at work. Because it let you pick a nickname, co-workers immediately gave themselves names of other employees and started sexually harassing each other and being asses. I pulled it down immediately before they got me fired. Anonymity does something to some people. They lurk among us biding their time, looking for any opportunity to be reputationally unrestrained.
embedding-shape 1 day ago|
"What I learned" seems to missing what used to be shared to every starting web developer; "If you allow user input on public internet pages, people will put vulgar, racist, hacking attempts and worse there, sometimes constantly over long periods of time"

Almost anyone who had a "guest book" had pre-moderation some way or another, or was a tiny-tiny website with barely any visitors. The second the larger cyberspace ecosystem got a whiff of your user-input-enabled website, the spamming would appear.

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