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Posted by geox 12 hours ago

ICE will release body cam video only when seen in the agency's 'best interests'(apnews.com)
144 points | 76 comments
AnEro 11 hours ago|
I've personally completely avoided the USA because of ICE, not because of principle of border policies purely from unpredictable treatment of people in custody with no recorse. Even if mistreatment are edge cases I've got no faith in the system to correct the wrong within itself. I've seen too many stories of legal americans and travelers not even getting bare minimum due process, or just being locked away for days no contact. I present and am read as a woman, if I get sent to male holding facility I'm just chum in the water. Which that decision could be made completely at the whim of the officer and the areas commanding officer, regardless of local laws.
jancsika 11 hours ago||
> if I get sent to male holding facility I'm just chum in the water.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBTQ_people_in_prison

AnEro 11 hours ago||
>V-coding is the practice of assigning trans women placed in men's prisons to cells with aggressive cisgender male cellmates as both a reward and a means of placation for said cellmates, so as to maintain social control and to, as one inmate described it, "keep the violence rate down".[170] Trans women used in this manner are often raped daily; and this process has been described as so common that it is effectively "a central part of a trans woman's sentence"
NDlurker 11 hours ago||
Oh my God. That's a blatant rights violation.
glaslong 10 hours ago||
Yup. Many such.
josefritzishere 10 hours ago||
Sorry America is in the bad place right now.
glaslong 59 minutes ago|||
Thanks, here's to better days, and the will to make them happen.
gumby 8 hours ago|||
When has it not been?
xyzelement 11 hours ago|||
Where are you from?
AnEro 11 hours ago||
Canada, I've turned down opritunities even in blue states over this being 100% honest. My Job used to involve myself traveling through the mostly the south. I'm lucky they are accomidating and shifted those responsiblties around but still pre-covid and a little 'post'-covid I was basically living month or so at a time in the south without issues.
xyzelement 11 hours ago||
I think likewise millions or people live in the south without issues?
AnEro 9 hours ago|||
As a trans woman, that is a priviledge often conditional on being well above average income as well
water-data-dude 10 hours ago|||
Sampling bias. Most of those millions of people are white, cis, straight folks who present as the gender they were assigned at birth. The odds of something horrible happening are much higher if you don't check all of those boxes.

It's still rare, but so are most horrible things that can happen to a person. "There's a pretty low risk of you getting into a car accident, so why wear a seatbelt?" because the risk, while low-ish in absolute terms, is still unacceptable - so you do what you can to mitigate it.

akimbostrawman 10 hours ago||
[flagged]
ysemox 8 hours ago|||
You are a disgusting lump of hate barely able to pass for the shape of a human soul
pbnjeh 11 hours ago||
Jail, jail, jail. Nothing less will stop these Gestapo-esque thugs.

And if you’re waiting for the mid-terms, you’re already acquiescing to their plans.

Also, it says something — to me, at least — that I have to think seriously before posting this. All I’m calling for is timely criminal prosecution of what I think and believe are crimes. I.e. for a lawful process. Yet doing so puts me at risk of an overbearing, unaccountable response?

This is some serious sh-t.

the__alchemist 11 hours ago||
All enemies, foreign and domestic.
effseven 11 hours ago||
[dead]
MertsA 12 hours ago||
How does this square with FOIA obligations? I get ICE sidestepping transparency by avoiding creating the responsive footage in the first place, but once the body cam footage exists, what basis could they use to withhold it other than redacting footage for the typical reasons?
jjav 11 hours ago||
> How does this square with FOIA obligations?

ICE doesn't exactly have a track record of following any laws or courts in general. So I wouldn't expect them to answer any FOIA obligation.

This is the fundamental flaw uncovered in the US system by the current administration. Turns out that if one agency decides to go rogue and declare that no laws apply to them, there is no mechanism in place to prevent that.

chaps 12 hours ago|||
I mean, ICE is already sidestepping transparency by delaying FOIA requests to the Nth degree. Have a look:

https://www.muckrock.com/foi/list/?page=1&per_page=100&agenc...

orthecreedence 12 hours ago||
> what basis could they use to withhold it other than redacting footage for the typical reasons?

The basis is "come and take it." A court order doesn't work on the brownshirts.

xyzelement 11 hours ago||
What I got from reading the article - but not the headline or the comments.

- ICE is moving to start using cameras (currently not using them) so this move overall increases the amount of footage that exists and can be released.

- Their stayed approach is analogous to other law enforcement approaches already in use.

So the headline should be "ICE to start using body cameras". I suspect this is in general good news for ICE - most police departments that once felt "forced" to use body cameras have found that the cameras have been good for their image. Incidents that could have previously been trumpeted as an unjustified police action now have the context of what the suspect was doing just prior that justify the action. I think ICE is betting on the same and the "look what our agents have to deal with" footage may get public airplay into their favor.

We'll see

altcognito 11 hours ago||
Yes, I too benefit from controlling the publicity, messaging, narrative and history surrounding my actions.
Freedom2 11 hours ago||
Agreed, I hope the moderators here editorialize this headline to try and spur more neutral discussion. It's worth waiting to see what the outcomes of this would be.
wtfwhateven 1 hour ago||
I hope the moderators here do something about the AI spambot accounts such as the above.

One example is here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49076441

There is, of course, simply no good faith rationale for demanding the HN guidelines must somehow be applied to forbid someone quoting a spokesman of the US government verbatim. Honestly quite abhorrent and dishonest to try and pressure people to not even quote what the US government says if it makes the US gov look ridiculous.

The rest of the account is trivial, nonsensical quibbling about wholly honest headlines or otherwise generic affirmations.

A supposed desire for "neutrality" betrayed by a thinly veiled demand for moderators to censor and punish people for merely quoting the article itself if it doesn't make their favored politicians look great, despite it being the admin's own words. Further betrayed by repeatedly suggesting moderators change headlines to be more "neutral" (but in almost every case actually suggesting a borderline dishonest, whitewashed version to make the terrible actions be as mundane and as normal as possible)

mcmcmc 12 hours ago||
There they go making “Abolish ICE” sound reasonable again.
atmavatar 9 hours ago||
Surely "Melt ICE" would be a catchier slogan.
glaslong 10 hours ago||
It had stopped sounding reasonable?
mcmcmc 8 hours ago||
When they were just doing their jobs without being assholes, killing Americans and violating civil rights, ICE had a legitimate purpose. There’s no redeeming them now. Obama deported more people than Trump while also passing DACA. There are bad actors who abuse immigration loopholes and evade customs that should be stopped. It’s not an invasion or epidemic, but they do exist.
cdrnsf 12 hours ago||
So, presumably, not when they murder unarmed civilians in broad daylight? Or deploy chemical weapons around schools?
NDlurker 11 hours ago|
I saw videos from my girlfriend's kid's friends. They go to a school near where one of the Minneapolis murders happened, I think Alex Pretti. They had to evacuate some of the dorms because the gas was seeping in. I heard the same thing happened to people's houses who live around there. That's terrorism.
git-nebulous 10 hours ago||
This is why in almost all things the solution is less, not more, power to the State. That includes the violent, the legislative, and the judicial arms. Your favorite person or political position may be represented now but will not always be.
adverbly 12 hours ago||
Surely the well being of the public is in the agency's best interest! Right? Right guys?
fscknpublic 11 hours ago|
[dead]
john_strinlai 12 hours ago||
im not sure why they would even bother with the cameras at that point.
stevenwoo 12 hours ago||
This is no different than any other law enforcement agency in the USA historically - it’s a curated source of positive PR that they get taxpayers to fund - it’s never used willingly as a source of truth when law enforcement is in the wrong.
disillusioned 12 hours ago|||
Accountability theatre, quite literally.
georgemcbay 12 hours ago|||
> im not sure why they would even bother with the cameras at that point.

Lots of data to feed into their Palantir systems to keep track of l̵a̵w̵f̵u̵l̵ ̵p̵r̵o̵t̵e̵s̵t̵o̵r̵s̵ terrorists.

john_strinlai 11 hours ago||
>Lots of data to feed into their Palatir systems

i didnt think of that, actually, and facial recognition training and such actually sounds like a pretty plausible reason.

ranger_danger 12 hours ago||
It says why in the article... to make them look better by only releasing positive videos.
cdrnsf 12 hours ago|||
Accompanied by childish memes, Bible quotes and the music of artists that loathe them.
john_strinlai 12 hours ago|||
right, i read the article, and i disagree that selectively releasing "positive" videos would make them look better.
philipov 12 hours ago||
They don't care what you think. You're not their target audience.
john_strinlai 12 hours ago||
yes, i am aware, thanks.

(that's why i wrote my opinion on a message board, instead of a letter addressed to the director of ice)

philipov 11 hours ago|||
They don't want to shake the support of moderates who are already part of their coalition and aren't paying that much attention. Those people won't notice the selectivity, even if they hear about it in passing, as long as they're not constantly confronted with it directly.
fscknpublic 11 hours ago|||
[dead]
nashashmi 12 hours ago|
Acting like any other police officer at this point
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