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Posted by robtherobber 1 hour ago

Beef and dairy drive 41% of biodiversity damage linked to global farmland(www.oxfordmartin.ox.ac.uk)
79 points | 68 comments
8by3 45 minutes ago|
Not to mention that beef/dairy production is a primary source of methane which is 80x more potent than Co2, but constantly under reported due to its shorter half life. Yes in the long run that matters, but its all the more reason that we should reduce animal agriculture right away as the payback is much faster than limiting Co2.
enquirewithin 29 minutes ago||
What percentage of anthropogenic methane emissions can be attributed in cow farts?

I would hazard a guess that the incidental methane emissions from one gas extraction field would astronomically dwarf the emissions from cow farts.

krige 26 minutes ago|||
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methane_emissions

fossil fuels contribute 33% farm animals contribute 30%

Not astronomically; marginally. Anyone who's been around herbivore farm animals will tell you they fart. A lot.

Then again, farm plants are a further 18%.

modo_mario 11 minutes ago|||
Those fossil fuels emit what otherwise wouldn't be available in the carbon cycle.

A cow that's fed on gras and farts emits nothing that that gras didn't pick up and contributes virtually nothing to climate change in the long term.

lotsofpulp 2 minutes ago||
I imagine the fertilizers used for the grass to support the quantity and quality of the cows’ output require quite a bit of fossil fuels.
Llamamoe 15 minutes ago||||
> Then again, farm plants are a further 18%.

Yeah, but they also provide 80% of the world's calories to animals' 20%

dev_l1x_be 16 minutes ago||||
With corn based feeding.
tempfile 21 minutes ago|||
> farm plants are a further 18%

Apparently mainly rice growing. I knew paddy fields were bad, but I didn't know they were that bad. Per calorie I am sure it is more like a tenth that of ruminants, perhaps less, but still worth replacing with other carbohydrates.

Llamamoe 15 minutes ago||
All the more so since rice is relatively poor in nutrients.
throwawayffffas 10 minutes ago||||
I would argue animal emissions do not matter at all, methane survives about a decade in the atmosphere. Eventually breaking down to co2, co2 that was already in the atmosphere to begin with. Fossil fuel emissions are the ones that matter.
aqme28 8 minutes ago||
Not following your logic. A decade is a long time for such a powerful greenhouse gas.
shiandow 24 minutes ago||||
You would be wrong, they are about equal in size, both accounting for about a third of the anthropogenic emissions.
mklarmann 22 minutes ago|||
[flagged]
modo_mario 13 minutes ago|||
>Yes in the long run that matters, but its all the more reason that we should reduce animal agriculture right away as the payback is much faster than limiting Co2.

The long run is the thing that really matters. A faster payback only serves to cover the impact of those that want to keep pumping up oil and gas in the meantime(also to make synthetic fertiliser) for a few decades. It shifts focus from that on cow farts. As if the rotting plant matter and wild animal life that could replace it didn't emit any methane.

whyage 15 minutes ago||
Plenty of people (including me) are vegan, healthy, and happy. As omnivores above the poverty line, we can all make conscious and conscientious choices about what we eat. Going vegan is one of the most effective ways to combat global warming (if you're not in a position to donate large sums of money toward climate change research or mitigation).
firebot 8 minutes ago|
Give it a couple decades. Most 'vegans' stop being vegan well before that. I'll let you Google why they do.
testemailfordg2 18 minutes ago||
Unfortunately, the priority is increasing efficiency and ROI, rather than sustainability. This leads to centralization and operations at a scale which are not sustainable, without external input or causing damage to existing nature. De-centralization and sustainable practices are the only way forward, as it has been for centuries before us on this earth. Maybe space is the place for these kinds of centralised and intensive practices, like being planned for data centers.
dev_l1x_be 16 minutes ago||
Beef & dairy the industrial way drive this. Several studies and decade long experiments show the positive impact of the non-industrial alternatives.
imjonse 3 minutes ago|
And which do the vast majority consume because that is the only one satisfying industrial scale consumption needs?
avesi 21 minutes ago||
There's more nuance here than reducing consumption of beef and dairy. Moving over to regenerative farming practices instead of factory farming will also improve the situation.
rimworld 2 minutes ago||
cow farts lol
sudo_cowsay 44 minutes ago||
But it's also not like we can just stop eating steak and milk.
lukan 41 minutes ago||
Yes we can ... but most of us (including me) don't want to. (At least not completely)
enquirewithin 22 minutes ago|||
With the ever growing popularity and success of the ketogenic diet, it becomes progressively more evident that a plant based diet is massively suboptimal for a not insignificant fraction of people.
Llamamoe 11 minutes ago|||
This has nothing to do with plant and everything to do with rampant prevalence of gut dysbiosis and harmful gut bacteria feeding on otherwise healthy fibers and carbs, as well as processed carbohydrate and sugar overconsumption plus insulin resistance driven by sedentary lifestyles, inflammation, etc.

Ketogenic diet is a band aid to both, not a solution, and plants are not the cause of either problem, either.

williamdclt 18 minutes ago||||
Our ecosystem dying is also pretty suboptimal.
choo-t 16 minutes ago|||
You can do a keto diet without meat.
tonyhart7 31 minutes ago|||
we literally cant, human body its not designed to not eat meat
JoeyJoJoJr 24 minutes ago|||
But the human hand was designed to hold a banana.
lukan 22 minutes ago||||
Not quite true, but cooking becomes quite a bigger challenge.

But mainly, beef and meat is not the same, cattle needs way more ressources than chicken for example, or well, insects.

shiandow 22 minutes ago||||
There are other sources of meat.

Also dairy is not a meat.

mschild 21 minutes ago||||
Not all meat is steak. Reducing and/or exchanging beef for other meat sources can at scale already make a massive difference.

Chicken, for example, produces 10% of CO2 per kg of meat compared to beef.

tonyhart7 11 minutes ago||
if we going for efficiency, rabbit meat is no 1 choice
choo-t 22 minutes ago||||
There is no health reason to eat meat. You can get your B12 elsewhere.
hackernud3s 13 minutes ago||
You can get it from supplements. That's about it though.
tempfile 18 minutes ago||||
Ridiculous comment. The human body is not designed at all, and is very much capable of surviving without milk and meat. It's not even very hard!
lukan 4 minutes ago||
Surviving and prospering aren't the same things, though. And you do need to mind a lot of substitutes you now need, if you just let go of meat.
lotsofpulp 29 minutes ago|||
And yet the most populous country in the world has an enormous contingent of people who do not eat meat (on the order of hundreds of millions).
firebot 11 minutes ago|||
Sure and like half of them have anemia.
tonyhart7 21 minutes ago|||
who ?? if you talking about indian, they still eat meat (around 6 - 12 pound every year)
lotsofpulp 8 minutes ago||
“Indian” does not seem to be a sufficiently cohesive group to qualify referring to them as “they” (in this matter).

https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/06/29/religion-and...

not-kinsale-joe 19 minutes ago|||
Genuine question, can you explain why we can't?
catlike0076 22 minutes ago|||
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veganism
lentil_soup 16 minutes ago|||
you can, but you can also just reduce it, you can eat say half the meat/milk. Eat more vegetables and grains. Not only massively reduces the impact but pretty good for your body too
tempfile 20 minutes ago|||
I am not vegan, but I found dropping beef and lamb to be literally the easiest modification to my life possible. Dropping dairy is much harder, but as I am now discovering still incredibly easy to reduce.
hackernud3s 8 minutes ago||
Dropping lamb? Something tells me that won't be a problem for most of the people in this thread lol.
techterrier 41 minutes ago|||
Theres a billion or so Indians that might suggest otherwise
bitlad 33 minutes ago|||
India is among the largest beef exporter in the world.
savolai 27 minutes ago||
Does this make the vegetarians not exist?
lotsofpulp 37 minutes ago|||
Milk products are very prominent in many Indians’ diets. I wouldn’t be surprised if India’s milk consumption per capita is the highest in the world, given a large proportion of Indians avoid meat, so they might source more protein/fat from milk products.

If it’s not, it’s probably just poverty holding back consumption.

Edit: upon second reading, I realize techterrier was probably refuting only the steak part of sudo_cowsay’s comment

shrubby 29 minutes ago||
It's also poverty holding back millionaire consumption.

There was a research, which I can't be arsed to google with mobile, that compared western vegan diet and Indian omnivore and, yup you guessed it, the western version was less costly in terms of future proof.

But as with the zillionaires the human predicament depends on weather we muster the courage to limit ourselves or die to the extinction that's already manifesting itself in forms like forest fires, droughts and crop losses.

karakarakarakar 40 minutes ago|||
You can eat bugs
savolai 19 minutes ago||
[flagged]
throwthrowuknow 15 minutes ago||
We need a new caveat cliche for these headlines like how people love to reply “in mice” to health research. For environmental research it’s almost always “in the 3rd world”
chickenbig 26 minutes ago||
Does this mean we should be advocating for more intensive cattle rearing? Stockyards and special breeds may not be the worst way to meet demand and reduce environmental impact (measured by CO2/methane emissions as well as biodiversity loss, for instance).
choo-t 18 minutes ago||
It's far easier do avoid producing so much meat. A vegetarian diet is perfectly healthy.
tempfile 25 minutes ago||
I despair. Is it that hard for us to imagine eating less meat?
pjmlp 31 minutes ago|
Thing is, will be anything left after we destroy the planet with war, data centers, rare earth minerals mines, nuclear and battery waste?
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