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Posted by gmays 20 hours ago

At-home test for infected ticks could improve Lyme Disease diagnosis(www.smithsonianmag.com)
254 points | 92 commentspage 2
petermcneeley 5 hours ago|
Only some kinds ticks carry Lyme disease. Sadly I tried the e-Tick identification system and it was beyond useless.
p0w3n3d 14 hours ago||
According to evidence based medicine, infected tick's bite is not equal to infection of the patient. It means that the test can be false positive and based solely on it, people would start exhausting treatment for nothing
murderfs 13 hours ago|
The "exhausting treatment" is a single pill, once.
aliljet 18 hours ago||
Does diagnosis offer a better prognosis for those that are infected?
maxerickson 18 hours ago||
Yes, it's treatable with antibiotics and people that are treated get less sick. As stated in the article, prophylactic treatment with Doxycycline is the standard of care. Testing the tick is an alternative to that rather than something that should be expected to increase treatment...

The article also mentions that symptoms sometimes persist after treatment with antibiotics.

dofm 17 hours ago||
It also has the broader public health benefit of reducing the preventative use of that class of antibiotics, which lowers the risk of antibiotic resistance generally. (In an ideal world we'd never use them preventatively.)

Could be a very big deal if it could be made properly inexpensive. COVID tests were, after all.

dofm 17 hours ago|||
Absolutely yes, because the most severe risks are associated with the bacteria reaching the heart and into the nervous system, which is a relatively slow process. There's a window of a couple of weeks.

If you could know as soon as you were bitten whether there was any risk of infection at all, that would be very valuable information.

I think it's only a one in ten chance that an infected tick would transmit the infection, anyway. But you would know whether you needed to even book an appointment.

lima 17 hours ago|||
> But you would know whether you needed to even book an appointment.

Only if the test is sufficiently accurate to rule out transmission. Even molecular tests can't reliably predict that.

bethekidyouwant 17 hours ago|||
As long as you’re not getting bitten by a tick more than once a year if you do get bitten every time take the high dose antibiotic seems simple enough that’s what we do here at at least
dofm 13 hours ago||
Not everyone is in a position to take that approach so freely, alas.

So one more tool in the toolbox is a very good thing.

lima 17 hours ago||
Yes, but this test cannot diagnose Lyme in humans.
acheron 18 hours ago||
Great. Let's get working on preventing/curing alpha-gal allergy though.

Or actually let's just eradicate all ticks.

itintheory 10 hours ago||
I developed alpha-gal allergy. I've gotten many tick bites over the years, though none from 'lone star' tick afaik. I don't eat meat normally, so it was only a rare chance occasion when I ate something that triggered an allergic reaction: hives all over, tightness in the throat. It wasn't full anaphylaxis though, fortunately. After some research I thought it might be this allergy, but it wasn't until ~12 years later and an encounter with some pork dumplings which led to a similar reaction that I became convinced and got the blood test.
jtfrench 7 hours ago||
I’m in.
giardini 12 hours ago||
Why test ticks for Lyme Disease? Make a cheap, accurate test for Lyme disease in humans!

Jeez! Chasing ticks, c'mon, really, my f*ing intelligence is insulted by the suggestion.

balderdash 8 hours ago||
Yeah - I just want to know early that I need to start treatment not “I might be infected”
stevage 10 hours ago||
I think so that you can take antibiotics early and prevent actually getting Lyme disease.
giardini 4 hours ago||
But honestly what are the odds that you would find and successfuly test the very tick that infects you with Lyme disease? Gotta be pretty slim!
stevage 2 hours ago||
If there are areas where the chance of getting Lyme per bite is 10% then...about that?
hedora 18 hours ago||
Why can't the government or a generic drug manufacturer just produce the Lyme Disease vaccine? It is safe and the patent has expired!

(Also, I have the same question about the poison ivy immunotherapy pills that were common in the US before the FDA.)

Aurornis 17 hours ago||
There is a long, sad history here. Lyme disease is a popular topic into alternative medicine as an explanation for unexplained symptoms. There is a belief in these communities that the standard tests for Lyme disease are not accurate, so people diagnose themselves by vague symptoms like feeling tired or having headaches. It’s a sad situation where people who aren’t finding an explanation for their symptoms get drawn into forums or Facebook groups where groups of people confidently tell them that their symptoms sound like Chronic Lyme Disease and that normal doctors can’t help them.

This has created an intense fear of Lyme disease among people who don’t trust doctors and “do their own research”. That group overlaps a lot with anti-vax groups. You can see where this is going. Some people who got the Lyme vaccine because they saw it as the lesser of two evils and then subsequently had medical issues blamed everything on the vaccine, and it blew up into lawsuits and a belief that the vaccine causes these problems. If there was any real problem we’ll never know because the storm was such a mess that it made actual research impossible and scared so many people away from the vaccine that it was withdrawn from the market.

lokar 18 hours ago|||
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyme_disease#Vaccination
vintermann 18 hours ago|||
All those people who claimed to get autoimmune problems after the vaccine, must have been people who went to quite a bit of trouble to get the vaccine in the first place, so I'm not so sure it can all be written off as health panic.
Aurornis 17 hours ago|||
Lyme disease has a long, storied history in alternative medicine and anti-vax communities. I would not be surprised if many of the people seeking the vaccine early were in those communities and entered with a distrust of vaccines, but thought the risk of Lyme disease outweighed their perceived risk of the vaccine. Once they got the vaccine they fixated on it as the source of their problems.

This exact pattern has been playing out with the COVID vaccine and the HPV vaccine. There are communities who are convinced that every medical problem they had since receiving the HPV vaccine is due to the vaccine, even though they’re all having different health problems that also occur in the overall population.

maxerickson 17 hours ago||||
It's a bit of a stretch to describe These claims were investigated by the FDA and the Centers for Disease Control, which found no connection between the vaccine and the autoimmune complaints. as "written off as a health panic".

Of course you can just say they didn't investigate it enough or whatever, you aren't trying to make a reasoned argument and thus don't need to exercise reason.

lokar 17 hours ago|||
A problem with vaccines and the public is that when you perform any intervention on many many people, some will happen to (randomly) suffer some issue. To them, it is obviously causation, regardless of what the math (that they do t understand) says.
KellyCriterion 17 hours ago|||
There was a link on HN some years ago which reported entering a phase-III trial for a vaccination created by one of the big pharma.
KellyCriterion 10 hours ago||
Downvoters shouldnt be allowed to vote if they cant use Google:

Here is the link for all downvoters :-D

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32465108

(Aug 2022, exactly what I said with "some years ago")

cubefox 18 hours ago||
There is potentially a new Lyme vaccine coming out in about a year. The review process in Europe just started.

https://pharmaphorum.com/news/pfizer-valneva-lyme-vaccine-st...

monster_truck 18 hours ago||
Sign me up.

Used to be a big Event Of The Year when my grandpa found one after spending all day out in their 'garden' (a few acres bordering deep woods). I remember being maybe 11 when he found one, let me try and figure out how to crush it, I couldn't. He showed me how to use the butt of a butterknife and leverage to get the fuckers

I don't live anywhere near a proper forest and we've had several close calls this year, I caught one crawling across my scalp when I was getting into bed last month. Went and got tested just to be safe

I know feeding crows is really fun, but please don't. It's very important that they get hungry enough to eat mice sometimes. Same goes for deer, the past couple of years I've had them walk _towards_ me and my dog instead of bolting, presumably because someone is feeding them (by hand, not garden raiding)

codingdave 17 hours ago||
Getting a tick is no big event. It is just something that happens if you live near woods. I own a forest, and get ticks on occasion. Gross, but no big deal. Grab a tick-pulling tool and gently coax them out. Don't crush them or force them out with a blunt object, you are just as likely to tear their head off and leave it stuck in you, which just makes it more likely for you to get sick. Just remove them before 24 hours, and it is highly unlikely they'll give you a disease.

Ticks also get attached to humans in tall grass and forest edges, not from the trees. Walking through open fields is a more likely way to get a tick than walking through the woods, because that is where the deer sleep. They bed down in tall grass, and the ticks come along for the ride. So be wary of the grass, not the woods. As a matter of fact, the best thing you can do to keep ticks away from your home if you live out in the country is to keep 8-10 feet of grass cut really short at the perimeter of your property or wherever it meets the woods.

Young deer often walk towards people, too. They aren't born afraid of humans, and have natural instincts to freeze, not flee. So when their mama hides them, it is just as likely to be near humans, not in the woods with the coyotes. They'll learn the fear soon enough (definitely during hunting season), but until then they certainly have youthful curiosity.

Even so, "sign me up" is still a good answer. Home testing sounds great.

_puk 17 hours ago|||
I think you're being a bit strong with the "So be wary of the grass, not the woods"

In the trees they drop down on you from above. Had them do that many times.

The general consensus is to wear a hat when mushrooming in the places I've been.

lima 17 hours ago||
Ticks do not drop from trees.
dermacentor 16 hours ago||
Where is your proof?

They have thermal sensors on their forearms and are known to climb trees. Why wouldn't they approach from above?

codingdave 16 hours ago|||
https://www.cdc.gov/ticks/about/index.html

https://projectlyme.org/ticks-debunking-common-myths-and-mis...

lima 16 hours ago|||
Ticks climb low vegetation (not just grass) and wait for a host to pass by ("questing").

If you're going to disagree with basic textbook biology knowledge, the burden of proof is on you.

stevage 10 hours ago||||
Can you explain how short grass on the perimeter helps?
dermacentor 17 hours ago|||
Ticks can transmit Powassan and Heartland viruses within the first 15 minutes of a bite.

Still feeling cool, suave, experienced, and fearless?

codingdave 16 hours ago|||
Hey, thanks - I wasn't aware of that. Glad to have learned it.

But you can probably tell that there is no need to be snarky. Just your first sentence would have been more in line with how people engage with each other around here.

faeyanpiraat 15 hours ago||
I'd argue it's perfectly fine to have some snark reacting to a comment spreading a potentially dangerous sentiment.

I have at least one serious regret about trusting someone on the internet saying something incorrect confidently.

lima 16 hours ago|||
And tick-borne encephalitis, in regions where that is endemic.

No need to be rude, though!

thepasswordis 13 hours ago||
The tick you're talking about here (hard to crush) is a wood tick, the types that carry lyme are deer ticks.

They're much, much smaller. The size of a poppy seed.

itintheory 10 hours ago||
Deer ticks are hard to crush too. And I'd say typically closer to the size of a sesame than a poppy seed. I like to pinch them between the tips of two fingernails, but lighting them on fire is also an enjoyable way to end them.
WarmWash 16 hours ago||
This is great (if it's accurate) but the real gem would be a vaccine, which is apparently also coming out soon.
SoftTalker 15 hours ago|
There was a vaccine over 20 years ago. It was discontinued due to low demand.

https://www.cdc.gov/lyme/about/lyme-disease-vaccine.html

Looks like there are clinical trials of a new vaccine, maybe demand will be higher this time around. The link also mentions a PrEP-type of treatment, which would be given seasonally. My bet is on that one, big pharma loves nothing more than a treatment that isn't quite a cure, but requires constant maintenance.

fenestella 3 hours ago|
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