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Posted by Jach 16 hours ago

There's no reason for software to be slow anymore(danluu.com)
578 points | 415 commentspage 2
Kuyawa 13 hours ago|
Next time you ask your AI of choice to build an app, please tell them to use plain language without frameworks at all and keep modules to a minimum (ie. node express, ejs and pg, nothing else) and you will see a huuuuge difference
alightsoul 12 hours ago||
I had the same thought a few days ago. Coding agents have rendered frameworks obsolete. Apparently many people disagree though.
catlifeonmars 11 hours ago|||
I like to use frameworks to steer the agent. I constrain it different primitives for different tasks in order get the shape I want without explicitly prompting too much. You can think of it as API driven development
globular-toast 11 hours ago|||
If this is true, the frameworks will either move to the specs or, worse, remain in the models.

You can't exhaustively write down all the possible ways for software to execute, especially since many programs run forever (e.g. servers, GUIs etc)

So when you say in your spec "when the user clicks here it shows this stuff" there is the tacit expectation that this will always happen and isn't dependent on the entire execution path up to this point. You also wouldn't expect a server to just finish execution after processing a request because you forgot to write "finally, cede control back to the main loop" at the end.

These assumptions are the framework. Almost everything you read is likely written in a framework, unless you limit yourself to non-technical writing for younger readers.

You could try to formalise the framework in your specs. But you'll then end up copy and pasting these paragraphs every time you want another server program. These context frameworks will probably get names, just like today.

Or you could skip that entirely and pretend you're not using a framework, but you are. It's just that the most has already learned tons of frameworks. What worries me here is stagnation. There's no way for the model to learn new frameworks. But this might be a short term effect. Maybe software in the next few years will look quite odd to those in the future as we keep writing it in the language of frameworks we already know. Maybe they'll look back at these relics and ask "what is a view, and why did the model understand that?"

esikich 13 hours ago|||
Yep, I feel like there's less of a reason to use frameworks now that you can just have it bash out only the needed stuff on its own. I've been able to make some really really tiny C tools and I'm absolutely loving it.
albert_e 12 hours ago|||
Good point.

Maybe if this philosophy / approach has a catchy name it might be more widely adopted and we all can have better more performant web and apps.

hirvi74 12 hours ago|||
My experiences might mirror yours to some degree.

I somehow managed to avoid the entire SPA scene. I feel so vindicated because I am absolutely zooming with my tried and true Vanilla JS these days. I have tried React, Vue, Angular, and ever just plain TS, and I hate them all.

deadbabe 3 hours ago|||
And just use C.
_puk 10 hours ago|||
What's the stance on Astro?

That still overkill?

I find it decently fast out the box and possible to manage as it grows.

robertoandred 12 hours ago|||
> my preferred frameworks can’t possibly be slow and yours can’t possibly be fast
spockz 11 hours ago||
Basically you are telling the agent to inline those frameworks. It has access to the frameworks, their functionality, and how they implemented things, combined with countless examples on how to use those frameworks.

If only we had a sufficiently smart™ compiler, it could do the inkling, dead code elimination, and WPO across the application. (Oh we do have that, as long as you don’t write in JavaScript…)

steveBK123 3 hours ago||
No there's a simple reasons actually: we have surrendered entirely to web based apps & the resulting ad bloat.

You used to buy a computer, install an OS, buy apps and run them. Neither the OS nor the apps didn't suddenly degraded themselves with "free update" that were developed targeting newer & newer machines. You bought a new computer when new software you wanted to buy wouldn't run fast enough on it, OR the computer died.

Nowadays, you buy a new computer when the same software you've been running for years or the OS itself that demands to be updated "free" makes your machine intolerably slow.

Funny how that all worked out.

zahlman 15 minutes ago|
> Nowadays, you buy a new computer when the same software you've been running for years or the OS itself that demands to be updated "free" makes your machine intolerably slow.

This is, in my experience, not a thing on Linux.

arjie 11 hours ago||
I understand now that most software is slow because of co-tenancy reasons requiring controlling resources or simply because they're safely insulated from competition. e.g. GitHub is the former: you can give yourself a git host and CI/CD system that is much higher quality by yourself since you're probably not using its social features. I think things like Apple's five-finger inward gesture are the latter. Once you could do it and start typing but nowadays it needs to render the animation etc. before keystrokes register. This software is slow because you cannot replace it in MacOS.

But all these things will change in time. Hell is other people's software.

Nevermark 11 hours ago|
> Apple's five-finger inward gesture are the opposite. Once you could do it and start typing but nowadays it needs to render the animation

There is no technical reason that animation should take that long.

Someone said, "good enough" and let it be visibly slow. The reasons for that could be anything, including non-performant code in dependencies, written by other people. But it just does not take much computing power by today's standards to composite code-generated animation.

Somehow, despite year after year of percentage-speed hardware improvements, there are cultural and structural reasons people ship code visibly slower than it needs to be. And faster compute appears to be irrelevant.

arjie 11 hours ago|||
Perhaps the real tragedy is not the animation. It is the fact that previously keystrokes would register even if the animation had not completed and now they do not. Interaction once you've entered a new mode should be instantaneous. Instead we are faced with inputs going neither to the old app nor to the new app. In the prior world, I could do the gesture and type the letters and hit Enter and the animation would not interrupt me from getting to my destination. Now I simply <backspace> <backspace> <backspace> and suffer the ignominy of a software system that does not care about my niche needs and is nonetheless beyond my present ability to modify while retaining all else.
jshier 11 hours ago||||
Making animations faster is one of the main reasons why, despite all the glass effect rendering, the 26 Apple OSes can feel faster than their previous versions. (Not always, of course.) They simply shortened the animations. The 27 versions do the same thing. Of course, this doesn't help all interactions, but it definitely improves the first impression.
mrob 8 hours ago||||
Every visible UI animation is visibly slow. I've used MacOS computers before, and despite having hardware that benchmarks faster, they all feel slower than my old Linux desktop. The biggest reason for this is the animations.
inigyou 4 hours ago||
Windows used to have a checkbox somewhere to globally turn animations on or off.
eviks 8 hours ago|||
> There is no technical reason that animation should take that long.

The technical reason is you will not see all the animated beauty if it's fast, so animation forces feeds min delays for states transition

bdhdhduuyd 10 hours ago||
For me the comparison has always been 3DsMax vs Blender. Same kind of software, same kind of features, but Blender is so much faster.

Architectural decisions have always been important.

MaxL93 8 hours ago||
You could compare it to Windows vs. Linux in a sense. 3ds Max has decades of legacy plugin/SDK compatibility baggage, lots of commercial and contractual obligations with business/enterprise customers... and Blender has none of those things weighing it down.
bdhdhduuyd 6 hours ago||
Well, I have been using 3DsMax and Blender from the early versions and it's always been the case that Blender is way faster.

Legacy baggage has nothing to do with it, in my opinion.

inigyou 4 hours ago|||
Fun blender fact: every .blend file contains a serialisation of the complete data model of the blender version that wrote it. That's why they have a minimum file size of about 280kB.
moffkalast 10 hours ago||
Ha, I'm always struggling with UI performance in Blender. Undo takes ages and freezes up everything, modifiers start lagging mouse movement as soon as you have more than a handful of polygons. I shudder to imagine what Max must be like.

Though I must admit you can have an absolute shit ton of ridiculously complex objects in a scene, and it will run smoothly if none of them is in edit mode which is at least fairly impressive.

Lerc 15 hours ago||
Giving an LLM a program that does a well defined thing correctly and asking it to make a faster version and a crapload of tests to show that it performs exactly the same task is a great way to burn through a bunch of tokens and getting a faster program in return.

I currently have one running working on a multi path problem trying to make an A* heuristic that produces the same or better score for search time, paths crossed, corners taken (plus a few other metrics, like proximity of opposite direction corners of unconnected paths.)

I have another where I'm testing how well it can iteratively rewrite the same program without regressions and successively stricter resource conditions. Instead of progressively adding lines of code to make an over engineered behemoth, starting over with the previous version as a template of functionality lets it consider the problem increasingly holistically

devin 15 hours ago|
I would be genuinely interested to see how it evolves the same program over a large number of generations. Given a whole lot of software is more a collection of programs rather than a singular "program", I have to imagine that the outcomes would be vastly different in shape when dealing with smaller targeted, articulable-in-a-few-paragraphs programs vs many-years-of-business-domain layered programs.
qsera 2 hours ago||
Yes, Seriously, where is the native versions of LLM created slack, vscode and other memory sucking Electron apps. No one should need Electron now as well..
throwaway270925 47 minutes ago|
> where is the native versions of ... vscode

Those at least already exist, without the need for any LLM: Sublime Text, BBEdit, Notepad++

eru 14 hours ago||
The article links to "You can just choose how many bugs you want now" https://nolanlawson.com/2026/08/16/you-can-just-choose-how-m...

So going on a tangent: an additional mechanism you have that becomes feasible with LLM assistance today is proving your code correct.

canada_dry 15 hours ago||
I regularly support Windows users and when I do, I cringe at just how awful the experience is! (My daily driver for the last decade have been various flavours of linux)

High end Windows 10/11 machines (like my Alienware I9 w/ 64GB mem + RTX4090) seem a bit sluggish. Low end machines with Windows are absolutely painful to use!

I've install debian onto my fairly ancient Lenovo X201 Tablet and it is exceptionally snappy.

bensyverson 15 hours ago||
Much like security, optimization is now a function of token spend—which in some ways means it's a function of care. The reason why software may continue to be slower or less secure than it could be is simply that no one cares enough to invest the time and money in improving it.

Off-topic, but Dan, in the name of all that is holy, throw a `max-width: 40em;` on your blog!

hombre_fatal 12 hours ago||
That said, performance and security considerations can be automated by a reusable harness and I think within six months it will just be built in to things like claude code and codex the same way you might tack on a performance/security section to your project's AGENTS.md.

A crude example is how, when building a large forum project years ago, I had a checklist I ran on every new http route: authentication, authorization, validation, etc. just because it's trivial to forget one of them. Yet now the LLM can come up with a lintable/verifiable way to ensure every route has the whole kit by construction.

Almost every way I feel like I can provide unique value to the automated AI workflow (aside from deciding what to build at all, and taste) feels like it can be automated by better markdown.

tomveber 9 hours ago||
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nottorp 7 hours ago|||
If i had to complain about something, it's the font that's too small.

I paid for a wide screen monitor, let me use the whole width of the screen.

em3rgent0rdr 14 hours ago||
Reader mode (built-in to both Chrome and Firefox) does the trick.
softwaredoug 4 hours ago|
The problem is that there’s a tradeoff between MANY objectives, not just performance

You want code that’s fast, correct, stable, memory efficient, secure, usable, and more

The reason code might be slow is about product tradeoffs. It’s certainly easy to have an LLM optimize performance only, but what do you sacrifice? Is that an acceptable tradeoff?

Maybe slow code is a good idea if it’s the only way to get correct and secure code?

AlotOfReading 1 hour ago|
I've almost never seen the trade-offs you're describing cause the slowness being discussed.

Take slack for example. It's not fast, it's not correct, it's not stable, it's not memory efficient, and it's not particularly secure. There's a reasonable argument that it's usable, but that doesn't seem to have much to do with tradeoffs in their technology choices.

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