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Posted by runako 18 hours ago

New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro(www.apple.com)
473 points | 289 commentspage 3
mandarinclips 16 hours ago|
I really want to buy one for coding/dev work, but it's just too expensive. Not sure if the M4 MacBook will get a price cut anytime soon.
Zylokloto 16 hours ago|
You will not feel a difference in coding/dev work between M1 to M6 in a relevant manner.
user43928 15 hours ago|||
Two years ago maybe, when I wrote code by hand.

Today development work is limited by compile times and test run times, particularly with UI tests in the iOS simulator.

Hardware on the development machine finally maters.

booty 13 hours ago||
I work on a big web monolith on an M5 Pro 48GB.

I'm usually running about ~4 instances of it locally in separate Git worktrees, which (in our setup) means I'm also running 4 copies of the whole stack: web, frontend, Redis, Postgres, etc. These are rebuilt and torn down multiple times per day. Lot of frontend assets to compile.

Additionally, like many people in corporate environments, we do of course also pay a performance tax thanks to the security software we need to run.

So perf does matter for us.

We could, of course, alternatively... just run cheap shitboxes locally and have all our dev environments in the cloud. Certainly appealing in many ways from a cost perspective and you don't even need to give up DX really.

However, in the next ~5 years, as "actually useful" local LLM inference starts to become genuinely useful (for software engineering, this seems to roughly mean "the ability to run 28B+ models at usable speeds") then having local compute horsepower might start to look more attractive again. Even if it's not an absolute winner on cost/utility alone, the data privacy and cost certainty have value to many.

eknkc 16 hours ago||||
I have an M1 and M4 Max at office. I feel the sluggishness of M1 now, after years it finally started to show its age.
Gigachad 8 hours ago||
Maybe try reinstalling macos? I have an M1 pro personally and an M4 pro for work and I don't feel any difference between them, but I reinstalled a fresh copy of macos recently.

I feel like a big part of macos slowing down is installing too much crap over the years that sits in the background.

coredog64 16 hours ago||||
Have been considering a used M1 but I'm concerned that I'm going to get flash storage that's been thrashed to within an inch of it's life by someone running it as a poorly configured inference host.
Zylokloto 16 hours ago|||
There are sooo sooo many students and normal people using these devices or corporate laptops never seen inferencing or anything like this, its so hard to trash the storage of them, i wouldn't worry about it.
Gigachad 8 hours ago||||
I'm praying Framework becomes more affordable after the ram price inflation is over. Because I never want to buy another computer with non replaceable storage again.
mandarinclips 16 hours ago|||
Where's a reliable place to buy a used Mac? I'm afraid of ending up with a broken unit.
linguae 16 hours ago||
Last week I purchased a MacBook Pro M1 Max from www.macsales.com, which is owned by Other World Computer, a maker of Mac peripherals. My computer comes with a 1-year warranty. It was my first time purchasing from them.
mandarinclips 16 hours ago||||
Yeah, I know. The problem is that used prices right now are almost the same as what they used to cost brand new. Prices have gone up way too much.
nodesocket 16 hours ago|||
I also can feel a speed/sluggishness difference between my M1 Max MacBook Pro and my M4 Pro (14 core).
jtbayly 13 hours ago||
Honest question: Which one feels faster?
nodesocket 8 hours ago||
Obviously the M4 Pro feels faster.
jtbayly 7 hours ago||
It’s not obvious to me. It’s somewhat surprising, even, given the specs I just looked up:

M1 Max: 400 GB/s memory bandwidth, ~20.8 FP16 Tflops

M4 Pro: 273 GB/s memory bandwidth ~17.2 FP16 Tflops

nodesocket 7 hours ago||
True but memory bandwidth is not the entire story. Geekbench (while not a end-all benchmark) shows:

                      Single-Core      Multi-Core
  M1 Max, 10-core     2,204            14,004
  M4 Pro, 14-core     3,311            24,711

Single-threaded CPU: M4 Pro is roughly 1.5× as fast. Multi-threaded CPU: M4 Pro is roughly 1.75× as fast. GPU: roughly equal to a full 32-core M1 Max, with the M4 Pro slightly ahead in Geekbench Metal.
jtbayly 7 hours ago||
Makes sense. I am still getting a feel for the different levels of these processors.
sceptic123 15 hours ago||
Is the "Water Project" intended as a sly dig or some kind of nod to AI water use concerns?
napolux 16 hours ago||
So I guess M5 Pro is better, right?
sf1tzp 14 hours ago|
I guess so. It's slightly cheaper to buy 2x 32GB M6 minis than opt for 64GB sku (which is only available with the M5 Pro chip)...
FinnLobsien 16 hours ago||
Not a surprise with John Ternus taking the reigns as CEO in a week, who was previously SVP of hardware engineering.

I can't hate a direction where Apple becomes more about building great computers rather than trying to force more and more subscriptions. I do wish they would fix many of the long-standing OS and native app problems.

steveBK123 16 hours ago||
I do worry that at this point it's no longer just Apple's problem to solve. They need to figure out a way to take the rest of the industry with it. Maybe if their standards are high enough everyone else will look bad by comparison.

My daily driver personal machines are incredible pieces of kit, but everything is always getting worse because majority of software is some SaaS living in the cloud, or even if on-desktop is constantly updating slop.

Why does it take 10 seconds for my streaming music app to open when my machine is 10-20 cores, 32GB+ RAM, high bandwidth NVMe storage, and I am connected to gigabit fiber internet? The thing is autoplaying videos, and has about 10 different panes clearly owned by different product managers that hate each other. Half the time its pushing me some pop-up dialog I don't care about.

Winamp in 1998 took about 2 seconds to load.

FinnLobsien 15 hours ago||
I agree with you, but I also think sadly most consumers don't really care about this. The reason the internet is in the state it's in is because most people tolerate it.

Most people simply don't care about using well-made software so long as it gets the job done because they don't even look at other options. I suppose this is how carpenters feel when they see ubiquitous IKEA furniture.

Gigachad 8 hours ago||
I don't think polishing macos more will win more users, Windows is a flaming garbage heap where virtually every built in program is broken and people keep using it. Making macbooks cheaper and more accessible will do far more.
himanshumehra 10 hours ago||
price hike makes the deal not so sweet, but still a bang on device
tonymet 14 hours ago||
I’m still not convinced by the value of local models. It feels like ray-tracing where we are driving up the compute cost for a high cost and fringe benefit.
Gigachad 8 hours ago|
It's not worth it yet when datacenter compute is being subsidized and consumer hardware is massively overpriced, but the tipping point will come where it makes far more sense.

Particularly with Chinese companies pushing to get more out of smaller models. You can run really capable models on the top end macs right now, it just costs way more than buying credits.

pipeline_peak 9 hours ago||
I’m not really sure what the end goal is with Apple investing so heavily in local AI hardware.

Feels like they’re doing it for the sake of getting with the times, but why would the average Mac User care? I wonder if this an answer the OpenClaw craze.

mixmastamyk 6 hours ago|
Running useful models locally with privacy would be a great selling point. We're not quite there, but the next five years should be interesting.
manishmicrosaas 14 hours ago||
glad that i purchased mac studio this January
jbverschoor 15 hours ago||
Very well timed for John Ternus's first quarter.
drewg123 14 hours ago|
I'm so sick of "up to 2x faster" ...THAN WHAT? ON WHAT WORKLOAD? How can I reproduce these claims?

I really miss when vendors would run the SPEC benchmark suite and performance was quantitative, and not qualitative.

numbsafari 14 hours ago|
… from the fine print:

“Results are compared to previous-generation Mac mini systems with Apple M4, 10-core CPU, 10-core GPU, 32GB of unified memory, and 2TB SSD.”

drewg123 14 hours ago||
Running what workload? How can I reproduce it?
mytec 14 hours ago||
There is more detail in the footnotes found here: https://www.apple.com/mac-mini/
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