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Posted by bcherny 1 day ago

I am often wrong(borischerny.com)
332 points | 223 commentspage 3
glitchc 1 day ago|
This guy doesn't think deeply about any problem, possibly because he has never had to and probably because he has never wanted to. He would probably make a good residential plumber.
rando103747202 1 day ago|
You must not be a home owner because good residential plumbers are definitely out there solving the “hard problems” that techies love to bloviate about every day.
wiseowise 1 day ago|||
Who said anything about “good” residential plumbers?
rando103747202 1 day ago||
Literally the author of the comment I responded to? Do you not know how to read?

Let me deconstruct it for you.

His words: He would probably make a good residential plumber. would probably make a good residential plumber probably make a good residential plumber. make a good residential plumber. a good residential plumber. good residential plumber.

wiseowise 1 day ago||
Concept of sarcasm will blow your mind.

And since you’re so intent on deconstructing:

> He would probably make a good residential plumber.

Him making a good residential plumber≠average residential plumber is good.

AdieuToLogic 1 day ago||
Right and wrong are forms of judgement, subject to debate, and sources of resentment.

Correct and incorrect are at least possibly quantifiable and do not intrinsically involve subjectivity.

In other words, my being incorrect is something others can help me to understand and rectify. My being "wrong" is a position which can yield second order harm.

lopatin 1 day ago||
[flagged]
jeef_berky 1 day ago||
For myself, it was useful to write down the general approach I took when solving problems. But it is useful because it was learning about myself, not because it is the same approach as the author here, and not because that is some magical best approach.

I experienced maybe a minute of being "whelmed" or +1 out of 10 over baseline because I liked reading someone else that uses this approach. For someone who thinks nothing like me, I would imagine it feeling very similar to "draw the rest of the owl."

I don't think everyone needs to think the same way. And if we did want everyone to think a certain way, well, the author's style would not convince many.

imtringued 1 day ago||
You forgot to add the necessary context to make your comment less abrasive:

The draw the rest of the owl meme is not meant to be insightful at all. This makes it sound like you're trying to tear the author down.

You are comparing them on the basis of doing all the work in the last step, which is a valid way of looking at it but the author already assumed that he has the necessary skills to complete the task and he should slow down before doing the work.

Your post as is kind of misses the point of both the post and the meme without further context.

jeef_berky 1 day ago||
I agree with your feeling that the comment we've replied to could use a bit more context... or something. But I felt like I got the point.

Looking at this thread, it mostly just lead me to think about how things can be super insightful for one person, and totally meaningless to the next.

gregates 1 day ago||
Alternatively, things that are not insightful can feel insightful to some people, because they triggered some different, tangentially related thoughts than what was being communicated — i.e., the reader substituted their own insight for the author's.

Or because the author has enough authority that they are granted a presumption of insightfulness by default, even (or perhaps especially) when the concrete insight that's allegedly being communicated remains unclear.

pclowes 1 day ago||
Having listened to him give a couple of talks I am always struck by how much he talks and writes like Claude code.

I don’t think he farms out all of his writing and talking to LLMs. I don’t think Claude code was trained to emulate him or anything.

I think his “voice” has been filed LLM smooth by years of agent based interactions. He claims Anthropic engineers use an average of 500+ agents a day. They are human interfaces to token generators more than human to human communication. They are picking up the tendencies of their most frequent communication partner.

Unfortunately, I see Claude being wrong often enough that I view it as a faulty narrator. Often helpful, sometimes totally full of it.

And now I subconsciously apply this filter to anything that sounds like Claude.

Makes me nervous that my voice may be becoming that of a faulty narrators.

pixl97 1 day ago||
To err is human.

Higher level thinking has fewer constraints on being wrong than lower level subconscious thinking. Low level stuff tends to have some repetitive and evolutionary basis. Higher level thought tends to be more one off, less evidence based, and more exploratory until we get to the point of being an expert around particular concepts.

A huge amount of human thinking is being a parrot and repeating statements without a deeper understanding. For example when I say 1+1=2 I'm not thinking about it. If I say 638483+949948= calculation is necessary.

So in this, your voice has always been one of a somewhat faulty narrator, LLMs just may be further degrading the quality of the narration.

pclowes 1 day ago|||
Lets say you have a colleague named Bob. Bob is a pretty good engineer, but he is as confident when he doesn’t know as when he knows.

You can never tell his degree of confidence in his answer. For low-level things he is pretty good but for critical high-level things it is more ambiguous.

You work around this by checking Bob’s work. Having formal verification steps to check what he says.

Now let’s say you meet Bob’s twin brother Bill. Who talks and sounds just like Bob. He makes fairly grand high-level statements that you can neither test nor verify.

How much do you intuitively distrust him?

brabel 1 day ago||
Bob also knows how to quickly check things with a little bash scripting and tests. Can quickly switch branches to confirm regressions and consult documentation if something requires more information. His twin can also quickly scan for all the common security vulnerabilities in any code, and will do it without complaining as many times as you want him to. I’ve come to trust Bob with code more than any human.
mpalmer 1 day ago|||
Left, right, higher, lower, male, female. People love to explain the brain by dividing it in half, or into poles.

Nothing more human than to label, simplify and categorize, even in the absence of higher quality information.

lelanthran 1 day ago|||
> I think his “voice” has been filed LLM smooth by years of agent based interactions.

I've wondered this for a long time now: how does one differentiate between your voice getting "filed smooth to match LLMs" or your brain getting "filed smooth to match LLMs"?

After all, if we accept (as the token providers want us to) that evidence of language use as we see in LLMs is evidence of intelligence, then surely the reverse is true - evidence of machine-only language use is evidence of machine-only intelligence.

IOW, it's the LLM talking through you, not you talking through it.

m463 1 day ago|||
> I see Claude being wrong often enough that I view it as a faulty narrator.

I'm reminded of <insert-someone-in-your-life-that-generates-friction-here>

"Often wrong, never in doubt"

ramesh31 1 day ago|||
>"They are human interfaces to token generators more than human to human communication. They are picking up the tendencies of their most frequent communication partner."

I see this happening at work, too. All communication and collaboration between engineers has broken down. Juniors don't have questions anymore. Seniors don't discuss architecture anymore. Everyone is just off in their own world of feature work with the only interaction coming at merge time. Really depressing what has happened to our trade.

bmitc 1 day ago|||
> He claims Anthropic engineers use an average of 500+ agents a day.

What are they doing all day with that, I wonder?

pixl97 1 day ago|||
Well, trying to make RSI for one so humans don't have to do that work.

LLMs are still a very new technology in relation to human timeliness. There is a whole lot of exploration to be done.

saghm 1 day ago||
I mean, in relation to human timelines, so are computers in general. It's not close why you think that this is unique to LLMs.
pixl97 1 day ago||
There might be some confusion on your part on just how much AI compute has been installed in the past few years in relation to the total amount of CPU compute and the speed at which it was installed.

If the CPUs life was an hour, the GPU AI accelerator would have been around 5 minutes and is around 5x larger in total compute.

It should not be underestimated in any way the scale of what is occurring.

saghm 23 hours ago|||
No, I think the confusion on your part is around what it sounds like when you say "in relation to human timelines". Humans have been here for around a million years. We've been living in cities for several thousand. It sounds like what you're actually comparing to is AI computing to pre-AI computing, which is reasonable, but I don't really see how that is accurately described by "in relation to human timelines".
simonw 1 day ago|||
Does that mean 500 separate agents or 500 agent sessions I wonder.
sitkack 1 day ago|||
That isn't humanly possible, you will blow out your neurotransmitters and not be able to think. Only being semi serious, but we can't make that many decisions a day.
Kim_Bruning 1 day ago||
Right, but you can imagine eg a hierarchy, in which case you might only talk with -say- 10 reports directly.
sitkack 1 day ago||
That isn't typically how abstraction is tallied. The ceo doesn't say they use 15k employees, or the programmer uses 30B transistors. Or the director uses 120 workers. You enumerate what you actually interact with.
bdangubic 1 day ago|||
the former
simonw 1 day ago||
What does that mean though? Does it mean there are more than 500 different "agent" systems within Anthropic and employees interact with most of those in a daily basis?
stefan_ 1 day ago||
The problem here is that the latest Claude models have gone off the deep end in their communication, and there seems to be neither awareness nor willingness to fix this. "Having your writing and talking turn into Claude is the risk nothing names" or what vapid strange meaningless thing would Opus say.
someguy101010 1 day ago||
a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds
preommr 1 day ago||
And yet there's none of this uncertainty or caution with his posts that then go on to have massive ripple effects because of his position at Anthropic and the marketting related to claude.

I personally have a lot of anger and frustration with many people in the ai hypesphere that are just mindlessly frolicking around without a care in the world, happy to speak into the megaphone offered by masses that are in a rat-race to avoid some AI dystopian hellscape that keep getting painted by these thought leaders... and then going "oopsies... I am just human guys... y so mad?!"

excentricus 22 hours ago||
It’s sad to see how these insights and “drops of wisdom” have changed to the point where nothing substantial seems to come from people who are in a position to influence, at least to some extent, the software landscape and where the industry is heading in terms of practices and approaches. Instead, we get shallow, very basic principles, still valuable, but often little more than mid-level-engineer realizations being spat out.

The worst part is that the product, the actual output, often feels underwhelming and at odds with the narrative around it. Action matters more than the narrative. Show these principles in your work and in how you engage with the community, rather than through shallow thought-leadership mumbo jumbo.

Another thing I find skin-crawling is bragging disguised as humility and sincerity. Come on!! Expecting people to buy into that performance is, in itself, a kind of insult to their intelligence.

blinkbat 21 hours ago|
yep, my first thought is that if THIS is what qualifies as a thought worth writing down from someone in a very prestigious position, we are well and truly fucked.
beaker52 20 hours ago||
Mine was that if I (or anyone else not-hn-famous) had written this and posted it to hackernews 10 times, it wouldn’t have gotten anywhere near the front page.
solatic 1 day ago||
Title is click-bait with poor framing (i.e. if you are often wrong, then sometimes, you will be right).

Finishing your goals does not "make you right". Life is not a binary where you are either wrong, or right. Thinking that you ever become "right" or that you ever achieve 100% confidence that you have arrived at a "solution" is arrogance of the highest order.

Life is about getting better. Every person, every product, starts at a beginning. A beginning is not "wrong", it is early. We try, individually and collectively, to improve ourselves and that which we are responsible for. The decision to ship is not whether we have made something "right" but about whether we have made it better. We ship, knowing we will ship another improvement after this one.

> 2. Gather missing information... 6. Achieve the goal

Sometimes in life, you need to ship first in order to gather missing information later. You cannot do that if everything has to be "right" before you ship it.

> I love being wrong

This is not the essay of someone who loves being wrong. This is the essay of someone who loves becoming right. But the deeper truth is that you will always be "wrong" - unfinished, lacking knowledge, under-developed, incomplete. Do not love being wrong - love improvement.

ks2048 1 day ago||
> I love being wrong

I prefer being right, but to each their own.

kragen 1 day ago|
I like being right so much that, when I'm wrong, I change my mind, despite how embarrassing that is.
badgersnake 1 day ago|
“I am often wrong” is directly from how to make friends and influence people.
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