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Posted by simianwords 23 hours ago

Amazon blocks Meta’s new Muse AI agent from shopping on amazon.com(www.forbes.com)
150 points | 158 commentspage 3
fmajid 20 hours ago|
Amazon’s enterprise value is made up entirely of AWS and Amazon’s advertising business. Thus according to Wall Street their e-commerce is a loss-leader whose only purpose is to provide inventory for ads. Agents shopping on Amazon do not show Amazon ads and are thus antithetical to Amazon’s business model and need to be blocked.
logancbrown 1 hour ago|
Amazon doesn't provide financial breakdowns between Ads & E-commerce fulfillment and inventory costs, so take the Wall Street article with a grain of salt.
rajivjain 22 hours ago||
The real big question is what happens to display advertising revenue on Amazon, if even a fraction of its traffic moves to these agents.

Amazon ads is a relatively large portion of its retail profits.

Display ads are meaningless to agents. And agentic commerce is a huge threat to Amazon’s profitability.

No wonders, Amazon is actively banning these agents. but for how long is this even viable? Do we simply move our shopping to more agent friendly destinations? Is this an opportunity for Walmart to finally reclaim it’s throne?

sseagull 20 hours ago||
> Display ads are meaningless to agents. And agentic commerce is a huge threat to Amazon’s profitability.

Would agents be susceptible to advertising? If humans have issues differentiating ads from real results, and are swayed by TV ads and stuff (they are), then why wouldn't an AI agent.

I kind of assume they would, given how ChatGPT brings up garbage websites sometimes for my questions.

rajivjain 20 hours ago||
That’s an interesting thought experiment. How would advertising need to evolve to appeal to agents vs humans?
adamsb6 21 hours ago||
This is inevitably going to get looked at by antitrust regulators, either in this administration (depending on how much Trump likes the leaders involved), or in the next.
simianwords 21 hours ago||
Shopify seems to have no issues partnering with Muse

>We are excited to announce we are partnering deeply with Muse to enable agentic checkout with Shop Pay on all Shopify stores, offering people an easy and delightful way to shop and check out with Muse.

HardCodedBias 21 hours ago||
A remarkable display of market power by Amazon.

Probably to protect their advertising business which is very strong.

We’ll see how this plays out.

simianwords 23 hours ago||
There's a lot to discuss here - agentic commerce, IMO, is where things are heading. I'm completely convinced that people _want_ to shop using agents. But I want to understand the dynamics at play here: will underlying inventory providers like Amazon give up control and allow agents to use their website?

I find this question very interesting and I want to predict where things will head. On one hand Amazon has a lot to lose by giving up control on how their website is used. Ideally they'd like to control the full end to end experience. What happens to the work they put in their UI? All those endless A/B experiments to make the buttons look perfect?

But on the other hand - this is where things are heading. They can't stop agents from using their website. Not for long. And they have a lot to gain because overall purchases will increase since. They can accept it and create a plugin and try to offer as much "branding" as possible inside it. Or they can completely go against agents and block it.

Then you have to wonder, what really is the moat here? Amazon's logistics and its relations with partners and customers (return policy etc) and the trust it brings. The UI part dissolves and is no longer important.

Maybe they want only an allowed list of agents access to Amazon? Maybe that's where things are heading? They sign deals with maybe just OpenAI (for example)? Its not like Amazon makes their own agent + model. I would hate it things fragment this much.

edmundsauto 22 hours ago||
In theory, legislation could help. If there were a pro-consumer movement in government.

Something like declaring agents as representatives of consumers and blocking them violates ADA or just shouldn’t be allowed unless they are abusive.

Lacking that, it seems it’ll be an arms race between offense and defense. At some point, computer control probably wins (running my browser, on my computer, is pretty difficult to detect with reasonable f1 score)

majorchord 23 hours ago|||
Anything is possible I suppose... I don't see a path that leads to Amazon actually further controlling the shopping experience inside a browser (where a local agent might have control that they can't reliably detect), short of forcing users into some kind of hardware-based attestation solution or something, but even that is not foolproof.
dylan604 23 hours ago||
> On one hand Amazon has a lot to lose by giving up control

The everyday person is told to get over it and accept that AI is here so adapt or die. Companies start reducing headcounts to be replaced with AI. So now, a company is having to accept that people are using AI in ways they don't like so they should adapt or die as well too, right? I have no tears to shed if Amazon loses control. Also, it'll be one billionaire battling another billionaire at that point, and I'm kind of okay with that chaos. My world is no longer in my control so fuck 'em is my stance

edmundsauto 22 hours ago|||
It’s an optimistic view on AI - brings power to the people by mediating all the garbage.

I’ve already used it to handle customer support request calls. I see 30+ minute hold+conversation times and generally the issue gets resolved. That is hugely empowering.

simianwords 23 hours ago|||
OK according to game theory, if this is correct, why even put up a fight? You have nothing to gain by fighting. Just accept it and play along. Make your damn MCP. You have 100,000 engineers. Why can't connect Amazon to ChatGPT today? I don't know.
majorchord 22 hours ago||
> Why can't connect Amazon to ChatGPT today? I don't know.

They just don't want to, because there's no ads. The human gets removed from the loop of visiting the site entirely. And it doesn't say Amazon all over it.

dylan604 16 hours ago||
If the user is not browsing the site/app, Amazon cannot collect the analytics about your browsing habits. The AI system does though. There is absolutely no incentive for Amazon to discourage users from using their system. After all, the AI system might not show the user an Amazon item.
llmslave 23 hours ago||
Amazon cant hold this off for the long run, nobody wants to scroll through a list of two hundred near identical packages of toilet paper. Agents will intermediate, and they will remove demand for low value items
threetonesun 22 hours ago||
This is already solved by the existence of hundreds of other stores that actually do some level of filtering and curation of products. I don't know why we want to play some cat and mouse game of getting an LLM to find the best toilet paper on Amazon versus just finding a reliable source of toilet paper to begin with.
jejee112 21 hours ago||
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gunalx 23 hours ago|||
Theh will probably consolidate more. Less choices even if they are worse is also easier for llms to do. Just look at how they pick technologies to use. Almost always the same for a given model.
micromacrofoot 22 hours ago||
Amazon is just trying to get you to use their agent, so they're not anti-agent, just anti-someone-else's
simianwords 22 hours ago||
I would hate it if every company comes up with their own agent and only their agent is allowed to access the API. EU do your thing instead of cookie banners plz.
micromacrofoot 22 hours ago||
that's what they're going to do, trying to get $20 out of the average person is terrible compared to giving away your product for free and getting an endless supply of metadata
zafara_ilands 18 hours ago|
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