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Posted by alsetmusic 1 day ago

U.S. Small Biz Can't Ship to the EU Anymore(glog.glennf.com)
61 points | 79 comments
t0mpr1c3 1 day ago|
I used to manufacture specialized consumer electronics in Shenzhen and sell them worldwide through Etsy. When Britain left the EU I stopped shipping to the UK rather than deal with VAT. I eventually stopped shipping outside the US altogether because shipping and administrative costs ate all the profit. When tariffs on Chinese goods went over 100% in 2024 I packed it in altogether. Bye bye side gig. The demand is still there. Maybe in 10 years I'll pick it up again.
veeti 1 day ago||
These fees were sucessfully lobbied in the media as a "Temu tax", and even reputable state broadcasters continue to refer to it as a "junk fee". However, it applies indiscriminately to everything from a decades old vintage book purchased from the UK, or spare parts to restore electronics ordered from Japan.
graemep 1 day ago||
Its a barrier to competition (what people here like to call a moat) that favours big business and mainstream products over small business and niche products.
anewhnaccount2 1 day ago||
Exactly. I live in Finland bought an educational English grammar for kids book for my son 2nd hand from a private seller for 4 euros with 4 euros shipping from the UK. The final cost after all fees was was around 25 euros. It's not just for junk it's for everything. It's an Amazon subsidy (should have used amazon.de).
account42 19 hours ago||
eBay? For some reason the customs fee they quote for shipments from the UK is ridiculously high - often over 10€ for a similarly priced item and not just the 3€ line item minimum plus change. It's ridiculous when UK->Germany shipments are often more than twice the price of US->Germany shipments.
gucci-on-fleek 1 day ago||
I volunteer with a small US-based non-profit publisher [0], and this all matches my experience. We publish black-and-white technical journals that are worth almost nothing, and our European subscribers have occasionally been charged 20€ per copy by their customs authorities [1].

We're now prepaying the duties, which seems to have solved that problem, but a few months ago our printer informed us that we will now have to pay this additional €3 fee per copy, plus some undisclosed additional markup charged by the shipping intermediary. But at least they'll handle everything for us without any paperwork, so this is just expensive rather than a bureaucratic nightmare.

But unfortunately this fee seems unavoidable for us—we only mail ~300 copies to Europe per issue, so having multiple printing locations is infeasible; I've checked with a few other printers and they all quoted me double what our current printer charges, so it would be way too expensive to print everything in Europe; and timeliness is important for a periodical, so people can't just order in bulk. So it seems like we'll probably just have to raise our subscription rates again to cover these fees.

[0]: https://tug.org/TUGboat/contents.html

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48246014

jleyank 1 day ago||
Fwiw, non us businesses have the same problem trying to ship to the us. It’s how governments want to roll now and how they generate counter actions.
tetromino_ 1 day ago|
The US idiocy was to whiplash de minimis regulations. The US gov't suddenly raised the de minimis threshold to $800; with the easily foreseeable effect that the country got flooded with crap from Temu; and then reacted by eliminating de minimis completely.

If they'd just kept the threshold at $200, all the chaos could have been avoided...

account42 19 hours ago|||
The EU also got rid of customs minimums and (at least in germany) has been letting delivery companies charge highway robbery fees to pay the couple of euros and cents for you at the border. The $3 per linie item that is on top of that mess.
t0mpr1c3 1 day ago|||
To my mind, the increase from $200 to $800 was more of a pragmatic policy tweak than a change of course. It was a recognition that US customs had limited capacity to check the value of small packages.
thehappypm 1 day ago||
This is not a tariff issue, unbelievably, but one about reducing competition.

I’m not sure I’m following the argument here, because tariffs are all about protectionism, which is a form of reducing external competition

Arodex 1 day ago|
It is not a tariff issue because there are no tariffs.

The author says so, if you take the time to read the actual article:

>I say this isn’t a tariff issue, and it’s not—these are existing customs charges that were waived for these low-cost shipments.

It is US companies having to pay VAT just like EU companies (the author seems surprised EU member states have varying VAT rates, but it is the same across the US), and private shipment companies deciding to push administrative costs to the customers. And inflation and energy costs soaring, due to a certain (US) administration going all-in on AI and foreign wars (which also affect intra-EU shipping).

But guess what: it costs less to ship something between two neighbouring European countries than across the Atlantic ocean. That's still not a tariff.

gucci-on-fleek 1 day ago||
> It is US companies having to pay VAT just like EU companies

I volunteer with a small US-based non-profit, and we only mail really inexpensive items ($4.50 each). We've been prepaying the VAT for a few years now [0], but our printer still informed us that we need to pay this new €3 fee, on top of the VAT and shipping fees that we're already paying [1].

We have no problem at all with paying taxes (even 30% of $4.50 is still really cheap), but a fixed €3 fee per item is brutal on an item that we're selling for less than €4. And the typical methods to reduce the impact of this fee like shipping in bulk don't really work for us, because timeliness is important for a periodical and most people only want a single copy of each issue.

> and private shipment companies deciding to push administrative costs to the customers

Our printer was rather evasive when we asked about this, but as far as I can tell, the €3 fee is imposed by the government, and then the shipping intermediaries will charge some undisclosed additional amount on top of this fee.

[0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48246014

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49796808

nemomarx 1 day ago||
> This is a story of the end of de minimis shipping, which figuratively means “too small to trifle with.”

Didn't the US also end de minimis exceptions recently? Can we really expect other countries and economic zones to keep them if we don't?

tempestn 1 day ago||
Yes, the US started this scrapping of de minimis exemptions.
readthenotes1 1 day ago||
Well, if they're too small to trifle with, it would be irrational to trifle with them, wouldn't it?
torlok 1 day ago||
The EU closed a tax loophole, and I'm happy to support small local businesses over people shipping things from overseas. I'm sure there are edge cases, but overall I don't see an issue here.
olivergregory 1 day ago||
Living in Belgium, my country has people producing stuff. But does it have a small business producing that one specific item I absolutely require for my project? It’s very likely it doesn’t. If I extend my search to the whole of EU, yes, probably one or two small businesses make those. Are there sufficient people in Belgium to buy this item if I wanted to create a small business to do so? No.

This tax is probably closing a loophole, but it’s badly designed and hurts small businesses more than anything because small businesses are the most likely to send to other countries to build their initial base. This tax reduces the discovery of what people do in ways no other tax did before.

Ekaros 1 day ago|||
I am not happy to pay to any retailer big or small multiple times the price for same item they ordered in bulk...
account42 18 hours ago||
No this even further consolidates international shipping to big e-commerce platforms while adding yet another tax to EU residents for items even where no local producer exists or can exist.
oliwarner 1 day ago||
Small businesses in the EU can't ship to the EU.

These new waste charges require administration that put a de facto floor on minimum monthly sales of €300-1500 per-country just to cover PPWR costs. It's insanity.

ginko 1 day ago|
The PPWD is a terrible law and should have never been adopted in that form. FWIW the commission is rushing to fix it.[1] Their general guidance is also to ignore this for now but I can see small business being squeamish.

[1] https://environment.ec.europa.eu/topics/waste-and-recycling/...

3stacks 1 day ago||
Small datapoint for me as a non-business entity going the opposite direction. I sell vinyls on Discogs and the last time someone purchased a vinyl from the US I was told I am classed as a business so I had to sign up with some private business which was a customs clearing company. They charged a flat fee and then a daily $1 charge for the entire time the parcel was in flight. I also had to do extremely strict business identity verification, which I obviously couldn't do as an individual.

It's such a mess of a situation.

account42 19 hours ago|
As someone who buys a lot internationally (because fuck localized media), this has been really annoying. Already had packages that the seller either couldn't ship or which returned all the way around the world. All this ends sup doing is consoldating international commerce even further as eBay and Amazon happily handle this mess for the seller (for a fee and/or cut of the sale price of course).

> VAT: EU member states have varying VAT rates, which surprised me when I learned this a few years ago, particularly for books—some charge 0%, some 40%. For a long time, as a small seller, you could ship DDU (deliver duty unpaid) to an EU customer with the correct price and tariff code declarations, and the customs office or shipper would collect the necessary VAT. Customers didn’t love this, as they’d like to see the final price at checkout, but most understand that the intricacy of VAT (or GST) would overwhelm a small business. Some shippers add agent fees, though, which bumped costs up—sometimes around US$5, sometimes much higher.

It used to be that those packages ended up at a customs depot but I guess it wasn't cost effective for them so they decided to let the shipping companies handle it. Of course they use it as an excuse to extort exhorbitant feeds for a "service" that you never agreed to in the first place and which would be straight up illegal for any other money lender.

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