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Posted by Muhammad523 4 hours ago

NASA’s Mars Sample Return mission is dead(www.science.org)
228 points | 171 commentspage 3
jmyeet 2 hours ago|
I'm surprised nobody has mentioned this but one reason not to do this mission is that we have ~400 Martian samples from meteors found on Earth [1]. The fact that there's even 1 is kind of amazing to me. And this has been confirmed by multiple methods including analyzing the air bubbles trapped in the rock matching Mars's atmosphere.

Flying to Mars and then flying back is incredibly complicated and much more expensive. Rather than sending an exploratory rover or a satellite, you have to basically send an entire launch vehicle when we've never launched anything into orbit from Mars before. And it has to operate essentially autonomously (for the launch).

Even missions to get samples from comets and asteroids are far less complicated because you're not dropping into a gravity well with just enough atmosphere to cover all your stuff in dust but not enough for atmospheric braking. Mars has the exact wrong amount of atmosphere.

Obviously samples returned from Mars would be better but it diminishes the value when we already have samples here. So the huge price tag and incredible engineering complexity becomes harder to justify.

[1]: https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/martian-meteorites-rare-visit...

Waterluvian 2 hours ago|
> we have ~400 Martian samples from meteors found on Earth

We have Mars rocks at home.

> Obviously samples returned from Mars would be better

The Mars rocks at home.

Muhammad523 2 hours ago||
The martian samples from meteors found on Earth aren't as good as the samples we'd get from a Mars Sample Return Mission because they have been in contact with stuff like water, air and who knows what else
ck2 2 hours ago||
don't boo, vote

I was holding my breath for Nancy Grace Roman Space Telescope which amazingly wasn't cancelled but they did cancel its successor, the Habitable Worlds Observatory Space Telescope which would be able to spot earth-sized exo-planets

even though Congress already funded it, because somehow the executive is allowed to illegally pocket veto Congress over and over again past two years

it's all Heritage Foundation and Russell Vought, he has no use for science and education

mring33621 3 hours ago||
My bet is that the new Trump-flavored NASA still wants to do this, but without the Europeans.
LorenDB 3 hours ago||
Knowing Jared Isaacman, he won't let MSR die without a fight. It wouldn't shock me to see NASA consider Rocket Lab's MSR proposal; they had submitted a pretty affordable proposal some time ago.
bpodgursky 1 hour ago||
Isaacman definitely likes scientific missions but was skeptical of MSR, he thinks we will have a manned mission to Mars by the late 2030s so the payoff was not there given the extremely long timeline and high costs.

And I mean I agree, for that much money we should be doing missions to Europa instead.

wood_spirit 3 hours ago||
Yes the administration warned American space companies not to attend the international space summit in France last week because it was international cooperation. NASA attended.
raverbashing 3 hours ago||
Honestly this is not surprising, and as much as politics suck, the rocket equation sucks harder

Mars has a little bit less gravity than Earth

How big would a rocket need to be even to send a small payload (let's think 20kg/45lb) even suborbitally so that it can be caught by another spaceship

Now check how big a rocket has to be to send all of that from Earth

You'd probably have to send this on Starship. And refuel it while on orbit

hackingonempty 3 hours ago||
The USA can't afford to waste money shipping a bunch of rocks halfway across the Solar system just so some woke geeks can speculate if Mars in the past could have supported transgender athletes.

It would jeopardize important national security projects like the White House Ballroom, the Triumphal Arch, the Garden of Heroes and National Golf Course, and of course the Donald J. Trump Center for The Performing Arts (formerly The Memorial To That Loser That Got Assassinated.)

TedDoesntTalk 3 hours ago||
Although I don’t agree with your phrasing, $11 billion to bring back some rocks when we have a $40+ trillion deficit makes no sense.
9dev 3 hours ago|||
Sure does. R&D investments have a massively larger RoI than military spending - and you won’t be paying off that debt by trying to be frugal. The only way is forward, and bombing schools in Iran isn’t that. It might not be Mars either, but at the very least some interesting science falls out of it, and perhaps some interesting products out of that.
maxdo 4 minutes ago||
The way we spend military budget is inefficient yet, Americans grew in 90s not to say eu people tend to believe we live in the rosy world of friendly people , despite countries like North Korea , Iran , Russia , and even China to a certain extent.
KaiMagnus 2 hours ago|||
Kinda crazy that we could launch one mission like this daily for almost exactly ten years with that deficit.
Muhammad523 3 hours ago|||
I was reading this outraged until i realized you were being sarcastic, lol
MiloLeo 3 hours ago||
After reading this comment I think it would be worth 11 billion dollars just to get you off this forum.
dpcx 2 hours ago||
I think the post was missing a </sarcasm> flag.
q_andrew 3 hours ago||
This is so disappointing. The closest thing we ever discovered to life on other planets and the US won't even put 0.5% of budget towards retrieving it.
DiggyJohnson 3 hours ago||
That would be a MASSIVE portion of the budget for a single discretionary item.
q_andrew 3 hours ago||
I guess I should clarify, I meant 0.5% to NASA in general. Right now it's 0.33%. In 2002 it was 0.72%.
TedDoesntTalk 3 hours ago||
The article says $11 billion. That’s ridiculous.
9dev 3 hours ago||
…ridiculously low compared to a Defense budget of $1500 billion? Agreed.
Vaslo 6 minutes ago||
I’d rather have a defense system over space junk.
GardenLetter27 3 hours ago|||
And Europe is even worse, it's embarrassing.
ModernMech 3 hours ago|||
[flagged]
superxpro12 3 hours ago||
best we can do is buying communications hubs and converting them into fascist propaganda machines
carabiner 3 hours ago||
We cannot cancel anything ever because each program is only 0.001% of the federal budget. To do so would be stingy.
sophacles 3 hours ago||
Or we could look at the utterly stupid things, like maybe stop having a failed war in Iran, and just not pay for those? Thats a very big chunk of budget. As a bonus it would bring gas prices down, reduce future spending in VA and other combat veteran costs, and just possible help make the case for reducing the size and expense of our military (while still maintaining the 2 largest air forces in the world).
method_capital 3 hours ago|||
That'd be a strawman.

What makes you think the poster you responded to agrees with the Iran war expense? He simply commented on how difficult it is to cut anything from the Federal budget. He's right. Remember when all the lunatics were out keying Teslas a few short months ago?

sophacles 2 hours ago||
No, its not a strawman. Cutting tiny things from the budget to save money when there are big obvious wastes right out in front is fucking stupid. Complaining about how hard it is to cut tiny things from the budget when there are giant obvious wastes out in front is equally as stupid.

If you want to seriously affect the budget, go for the things that burn large piles of money first.

drstewart 3 hours ago|||
Or we could reduce Medicaid fraud instead. Why are you pro fraud?
infamouscow 3 hours ago||
ALIENS! The alternative is just a bummer, so just let me live in delusion here, okay?
formvoltron 3 hours ago||
[flagged]
Simon_O_Rourke 2 hours ago|
Fucking retarded, just take whatever was wasted fighting a losing was for no good reason and spend it on NASA.