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Posted by volf_ 1 hour ago

Xiaomi MiMo v2.6(mimo.xiaomi.com)
282 points | 122 comments
rao-v 1 hour ago|
I know we have strong views on what a truly open model is (open weights, open training data, open training code etc.) but I really like how transparent they’ve been about the training of this model.

The realtime dashboard they shared during training (https://mimo.xiaomi.com/rl/) was an incredible learning and teaching tool for me, and they’ve been unusually comprehensive in sharing details about their methodology (check out that tech report - it's got lots of clever behind the scene tricks like Google or Deepseek writeups) and benchmark scores (even the stuff they didn’t do well on).

If you’re releasing an open model going forward, please consider offering the community more of this transparency!

MangoCoffee 27 minutes ago||
maybe this is why Dario want to slow down AI development and all the big AI labs in the USA is singing the same song.

whey they all singing the same tune. it make me question what is their real motives.

they are afraid of Chinese good enough LLM model killing their margin. we already have story about US companies switch some task to use cheaper Chinese model hosted on Neoclouds.

jwolfe 9 minutes ago|||
Please explain how putting an upper bound on how good the strongest models can be prevents cheaper less strong models from catching up, rather than enabling it. I do not understand this argument at all.
rbjorklin 4 minutes ago|||
The general idea is that Anthropic/OpenAI is pushing this narrative as an attempt at "Regulatory Capture"[1] which would allow them to make it prohibitively expensive for anyone but them to enter the market thus stifling competition.

* 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulatory_capture

chanakya 45 seconds ago||
How would that slow down the Chinese models, given that the US has no regulatory reach in China?
lytedev 3 minutes ago||||
I don't think "putting an upper bound" was OPs phrasing?
bellowsgulch 5 minutes ago|||
[delayed]
Pxtl 3 minutes ago|||
Dario has always wanted the AI development to slow down and be more careful. Safer AI development was a core reason that Anthropic split off from OpenAI.

What's different today is that now all the big LLM firms want to slow down AI development. When men like Musk and Altman (both known for habitually shooting their mouths off and saying whatever they need to whoever needs to hear it regardless of truth) suddenly agree with Amodei, that's when things start to smell off.

earthnail 1 hour ago|||
Thanks so much for sharing this. As someone who mostly watches from the sideline, can you share what you can see in this dashboard that someone like me can't see? Is it the metrics themselves that they measure (the metrics tab is absurdly detailed), something in the notices, or something else I missed?
rao-v 27 minutes ago|||
I might turn this into a blogpost if folks are interested, but my god there is so much clever info in that dashboard.

Here is one really neat bit:

A cutting edge training idea (for agents, it's been used elsewhere for ages) is on-policy RL, basically, it's not enough to say "here is an end to end agentic sequence (including tool calls etc.) that is perfect" you want to say "here is a sequence you might actually have generated that turns out to be correct".

Basically, it's more training efficient to improve models with small tweaks to do more of the right thing they are already doing sometimes than from some perfect oracular "this is the way" answer.

(if you've ever tried to teach humans new skills, you’ve probably noticed this too!)

When you do that, you care about how far the model you are updating (improving) has deviated from the one being used to generate rollouts (agentic rollouts for hard problems can take hours with lots of tool calls, so you can't keep redeploying every slight improvement).

Lo and behold, the dashboard literally has:

partial/avg_staleness (likely the measure of how many micro iterations the "generate answers" model is behind the "improving based on the occasional right answer" model)

train_infer_diff/new_infer/kl (a more direct KL divergence based way of measuring how differently the two models generate tokens)

How cool is that?!

And don't get me started on the clever ideas hiding behind dynsam/avg@n ...

dgellow 4 minutes ago||
Please do
tancop 37 minutes ago||||
The best thing they did is being open about all the setbacks they had to deal with. They logged every restart with a reason, talked about dropping a cyber dataset after it degraded coding benchmarks. Also published real time training loss, benchmark scores after every checkpoint and running cost estimates.

Really the only thing missing was dataset descriptions, the dashboard only had random IDs like "dataset-zrso". I guess it's their lawyers fault.

verdverm 55 minutes ago|||
the existence, who else has a live dashboard for the RL late-training?
ignoramous 20 minutes ago|||
> got lots of clever behind the scene tricks like Google or Deepseek writeups) and benchmark scores

Xiaomi MiMo is led by Luo Fuli, a former Alibaba & DeepSeek employee. Perhaps it is due to Luo just how similar Xiaomi's tech & GTM approach is to DeepSeek's.

- How Luo Fuli Keeps an Earthy Touch as she Soars Through the AI World, https://newsen.pku.edu.cn/news_events/news/people/15385.html (https://archive.vn/I8Pmu).

- Luo Fuli, the 30-year-old ‘AI genius girl’ behind DeepSeek’s success?, https://e.vnexpress.net/news/tech/personalities/who-is-luo-f... (https://archive.vn/sb3B6).

kingstnap 1 hour ago||
[dead]
lwansbrough 1 hour ago||
Anyone else more excited about Chinese models than American models these days? Big thing for me is affordability.
tacomagick 1 hour ago||
Absolutely! Chinese models are both cheaper and more capable in many cases, compared to the American models and their makers continuously fumbling or reducing model capability with each update. Deepseek decreased costs when they released Flash 4.1 you would not see any American company do this, in reverse they would try charge you more.
user43928 57 minutes ago|||
OpenAI decreased prices with the 5.6 model family.

And later they further cut Sol and Terra pricing by 20% (maybe only in the API) and Luna by 80%.

In fact Luna still outperformed DeepSeek Flash 4.1 in cost per task on Artificial Analysis when I last checked.

However, Luna is slightly less intelligent. I have a feeling that it's pretty dumb and prone to hallucination unless running at xhigh or max effort, where it somehow manages to work quite well.

I did not personally test the open weight models beyond the old Qwen 3.6 27B, which produced unusably bad results for me.

The competition is great, and I hope Chinese models will continue to force leading US labs to offer models at a low price point.

That said, I don't think the Chinese labs have anything over OpenAI and Anthropic when it comes to capability or efficiency - I have no reason not to believe the US labs have even lower cost to serve the models.

Implicated 8 minutes ago|||
> I did not personally test the open weight models beyond the old Qwen 3.6 27B, which produced unusably bad results for me.

So you don't have much perspective on things, it seems. Let me introduce you to the GLM 5.2 and then 5.3/5.3 flash series of... "oh, wow, I should have bought some RTX PRO 6000's while they were 'cheap'" stage of progression.

As someone carrying multiple max subscriptions to both claude and codex - primary workhorse is glm 5.3 flash running on rented GPUs for less than a latte/hr.

I also found qwen 3.6 27B nearly useless for my own needs. DS4 flash 0731 and then 4.1 have been nearly as eye opening as glm 5.3 flash, but have their own warts.

tacomagick 46 minutes ago|||
OpenAI had to cut costs because of Anthropic. I also do not trust the benchmarks when it comes to models anymore. I have tried both Claude and OpenAI models and while it is true that the 5.6 series is smarter than Deepseek (at the time i tested it against 4.0) at that price it is still not worth it and sometimes randomly refuses to do tasks or stops midway etc.

Do also remember China is this far in the AI race despite all chip restrictions from America. If they were in equal standards I truly think Chinese models would have long surpassed American ones. Also would like to remind how Anthropic CEO is being hostile and blaming Chinese models with distilling meanwhile their own models claimed to be Qwen¹ and their stance against open models is negative² and they still keep blaming China for it.

1- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48671252

2-https://www.anthropic.com/news/position-open-weights-models

goosejuice 30 minutes ago|||
> Also would like to remind how Anthropic CEO is being hostile and blaming Chinese models with distilling

Why wouldn't he? If there really was 25,000 accounts breaking ToS any CEO would at minimum be upset. Evidence of Claude distilling qwen would be damning but that a) makes no sense b) doesn't exist afaik.

user43928 28 minutes ago|||
Not sure about that.

Given the difference in compute, it seems plausible.

However, the researchers at the US labs are surely no less talented, and they have better access to hire talent globally.

They too have to serve their models efficiently at a large scale, and with current capacity constraints this must be a top priority.

goosejuice 38 minutes ago|||
> Deepseek decreased costs when they released Flash 4.1 you would not see any American company do this, in reverse they would try charge you more.

OpenAI reduced prices and Anthropic increased weekly usage limits.

bellowsgulch 3 minutes ago|||
[delayed]
SyneRyder 48 minutes ago|||
Yep, I'm trending in that direction, and I'm someone with Claude stickers all over my laptop. My main app dev work is still going to Claude, but everything else is going to China even at API rates now.

One simple task: I needed an LLM to go through and clean up a few thousand page descriptions and titles in my personal search engine index, where the human web page authors had put in no effort sigh. I did a shoot out between Claude, Luna, GLM 5.3 Flash and Deepseek. Despite the high cost, Claude's descriptions were terrible, and even Opus warned me that the descriptions coming back from Haiku were "generalized, not accurate". I expected I would choose Luna because of price, and occasionally it did have wonderful descriptions (one captured emotion in a way no other model did). But in the end, the GLM 5.3 Flash descriptions were the easiest to read, they flow well while also being accurate & including necessary keywords, and being highly affordable. So it won out. It's a task that is nowhere near frontier, but a task where somehow China is better than frontier.

rapind 15 minutes ago||
API rates still aren’t quite competitive with the OpenAI x20 accounts, but they are definitely getting close with deepseek 4.1 flash. I spent a few days with only 4.1 and was very impressed.
verdverm 53 minutes ago|||
I have a contrarian opinion that China passing America in Ai is the Sputnik moment we need to leave the hubris behind and get our mojo back

debatable if a turn around is possible before '29

swingandamiss 1 hour ago||
No, because I'd rather not support our economic and military rivals.
lwansbrough 1 hour ago|||
I'm Canadian so this sentiment has little value in 2026 unfortunately.
zemvpferreira 6 minutes ago|||
As much as the US has been easy to hate lately, I don't hesitate to say Xi Jinping as the most powerful man on Earth would be much, much worse.
ActionHank 58 minutes ago||||
Also, frankly, as a fellow Canadian it's pretty clear that the biggest "rival" the US has right now is itself. Just passed out in the corner puking on itself shouting about all the foreigners who won't talk to it.
tancop 28 minutes ago||||
I'm from Europe and I hate America way more than China now. Used to be about equal but then Trump started extorting Ukraine, threatening their own allies and sending billions to Israel to help with a genocide. I think that exposed America for what it really is.
scottyah 56 minutes ago||||
[flagged]
lwansbrough 52 minutes ago|||
Because at present the pedophile US president is making it his mission to molest my country. China, for all its faults (including espionage, which the US is also guilty of) is mostly focused on conducting trade.
verdverm 52 minutes ago|||
Half of Canada now uses the word 'enemy' when asked for an adjective to describe America or China. We're equivalent in their eyes now because we elected Trump a second time and all that he has said and done in 2.0
cwillu 31 minutes ago||
It's closer to a cousin you used to be close with despite some moral failings, but who has now has a substance abuse problem and is lashing out at family and friends.

Not an enemy, just a danger.

verdverm 21 minutes ago||
I'm relaying a poll of Canadians, their word choice, not mine

"plurality" would have been accurate over "half" on my part

https://www.commondreams.org/news/canadians-us-enemy-poll

rayiner 39 minutes ago|||
Canadians warming up to China makes me think of Germany becoming increasingly reliant on Russia in the 2010s.
rapind 13 minutes ago|||
Murica just has a MAGA problem. We can still be friends if and when you sort that out. Us Canadians like most of you quite a lot.
cgio 19 minutes ago||||
Yes, someone can still blow up a pipe and they look the other way. On the other hand, you can also draw parallels to themselves becoming increasingly reliant on US vs UK in the past.
Freedom2 1 hour ago|||
Agreed, and also because I support freedom of speech!
girvo 1 hour ago||
Neither the US nor the Chinese companies are on your side then. They both censor, just different topics.

But at least I can run Chinese models locally, and strip a lot of that censorship/refusal.

simonw 1 hour ago||
Pelicans for Flash: https://tools.simonwillison.net/markdown-svg-renderer?url=ht...

Pelicans for Pro: https://tools.simonwillison.net/markdown-svg-renderer?url=ht...

phainopepla2 52 minutes ago||
I think we can say pretty confidently they aren't pelican-bench-maxxing
brcmthrowaway 51 minutes ago|||
Just me, or do these look bad?

Qwen3.8-27b pelican was amazing on Mac.

https://www.nudgehost.com/dpjn3uwe

idiotsecant 49 minutes ago||
Looking terrible isn't nessesarily a bad thing. The pelican is heavily pre trained now. Having a crappy pelican means you didn't try to juke the stats.
broodbucket 32 minutes ago||
Apologies for not taking the time to find it, but there was a post that tried to determine if the pelican was benchmaxxed across a bunch of models by comparing it to other SVGs, and found that it wasn't at all.
handfuloflight 49 minutes ago|||
How does this translate to coding performance, which is what most of HN cares about (...I assume)?
simonw 47 minutes ago|||
It means they're good at writing SVGs, in particular SVGs of animals riding modes of transport!
lanyard-textile 43 minutes ago|||
I only visit HN for the pelicans, personally.
lukewrites 32 minutes ago||
Yeah, I thought the "N" was for Nest
Imanari 51 minutes ago||
ish… at least we can be sure they don’t benchmaxx the pelicans lol
stymaar 1 hour ago||
Flash[1]: 309B total / 15B activated parameters

Pro [2]:, 1.02T total / 42B activated parameters

[1]: https://huggingface.co/XiaomiMiMo/MiMo-V2.6-Flash-RL

[2]: https://huggingface.co/XiaomiMiMo/MiMo-V2.6-Pro-RL

verdverm 1 hour ago||
There's also a Qwen 3.5 9B distill

https://huggingface.co/XiaomiMiMo/MiMo-V2.6-Distill-Qwen-9B

gandreani 1 hour ago||
Those this mean they've fine-tuned this Qwen 3.5 9B on output from the V2.6 model?
mydreamof 1 hour ago|||
It is a 9B agentic model developed by Xiaomi MiMo through supervised fine-tuning of Qwen3.5-9B on MiMo-generated data
simonedepertis 1 hour ago|||
[flagged]
verdverm 1 hour ago|||
curious why the HF pill (on the right) always has inaccurate values
stymaar 1 hour ago||
I noticed the same, and I wonder as well.
verdverm 1 hour ago||
I suspect they are calculating something in the weights or config, I see it pretty consistently with quants
segmondy 46 minutes ago||
more like 500B in FP8
nemothekid 1 hour ago||
Looking at the frontend design examples; why do these models seem to love the "01 - UPPERCASE TEXT" motif. It's everywhere now (see https://try.cloudflare.com/, which has '01 · QUICK TUNNELS', but no "02" anywhere).
danvayn 1 hour ago||
My guess is that by function they break down frontend sections or components into pieces and I believe document things for themselves on some level, or purposely are verbose in this way. It is probably also shaped by users and existing web patterns. They probably get reinforced by models the more common they become.
pphysch 40 minutes ago|||
The extraneous small-caps labels are one of the main idiosyncrasies of AI generated markup. I wonder how much of this is a "scaffolding" technique to help the model build stable designs. But was it reinforced in RLHF or an emergent behavior of the models?
sandblast 1 hour ago||
Nice catch!
user43928 1 hour ago||
I don't trust any of the benchmarks where Opus 5 surpasses Astra or Fable 5.1.

Maybe Terminal Bench 4.0 and ExploitGym are reasonable.

Terminal Bench 4.0

  GPT 6 Astra             59.6
  Claude Fable 5.1        55.1
  Claude Opus 5           49.0
  MiMo-V2.6-Pro           34.9
  MiMo-V2.6-Flash         28.8
  DeepSeek V4.1 Flash     26.8
  MiMo-V2.5-Pro            1.5
ExploitGym

  GPT 6 Astra             42.4
  Claude Fable 5.1        30.4
  Claude Opus 5           22.1
  MiMo-V2.6-Pro           17.8
  MiMo-V2.6-Flash          6.0
  MiMo-V2.5-Pro            0.1
DeepSWE v1.1

  DeepSeek V4.1 Flash     74.2
  Claude Opus 5           74.0
  GPT 6 Astra             74.0
  MiMo-V2.6-Pro           71.9
  Claude Fable 5          70.0
  MiMo-V2.6-Flash         67.9
  MiMo-V2.5-Pro           19.0
mokre 1 hour ago||
Maybe you should not trust any of the benchmarks!
varispeed 47 minutes ago||
They match my experience. Astra and Fable I rate below Sonnet. They are incredibly poor. They were excellent for a couple of days after release and then plummeted.

Maybe I am being routed to more quantised versions or less capable models with system prompt to fake Astra or Fable.

vatsachak 1 hour ago||
Wow, the chinese labs are getting good at advertising model releases. The moat is thin.

Some features of the release I like:

- Demonstration of diverse tasks, such as using a DAW

- Graphs from various benchmarks and price ranges

- Real world use of the model in scientific environments

syntaxing 1 hour ago||
All these new models are such tease for us folks with 128GB of shared memory. Buying another unit now to expand to 256GB is a mortgage payment but it’s getting tempting…
verdverm 1 hour ago||
https://huggingface.co/XiaomiMiMo/MiMo-V2.6-Distill-Qwen-9B is an option
trvz 48 minutes ago||
That’s for toy GPUs, like the 5090.
verdverm 43 minutes ago||
there are many tasks (increasingly more each day) where small models are more than enough
brcmthrowaway 1 hour ago||
Is there a gamechanger around the corner to reduce DRAM requirements?
zozbot234 1 hour ago|||
You could always stream from SSD storage. Especially effective if you get a cheap old-gen HEDT with lots of PCIe slots to add NVMe storage to and reasonable overall PCIe bandwidth.
jkingsman 31 minutes ago||
That nearly certainly boots you to secs-per-tok land (as opposed to tok/s). Plausible if you are willing to wait hours to days for responses for simple testing, but not (debatably) "usable".
stymaar 1 hour ago|||
n-gram per-layer embeddings[1][2] might be it.

[1] https://sebastianraschka.com/llm-architecture-gallery/per-la...

[2]: See DS 4.1-Flash and Qwen-3.8-Next.

verdverm 1 hour ago||
this is to offload VRAM to DRAM (for GP comment), and makes no difference for URAM
zozbot234 1 hour ago|||
You can definitely offload n-gram embeddings to storage; they're very sparsely used (only a few KB fetched per token) so this is quite effective. Loading to DRAM only becomes necessary if they are a bottleneck to overall performance (which might happen if you're doing very wide batches and everything else uses super fast VRAM/HBM).
verdverm 1 hour ago||
I was looking at the qwen-next-flash, and the weights would fill my OEM Spark on their own, before the n-gram. I'm unclear if offloading to disk can work here, is that what you are implying is possible?!
girvo 1 hour ago||
Check out eugr’s TP=1 sparkrun recipe :)

It’s an NVFP4 quant, but it fits, and is surprisingly capable.

verdverm 1 hour ago||
do you have a HF link? HF search is not uncovering it for me

(or is it somewhere else)

girvo 36 minutes ago|||
https://github.com/spark-arena/eugr-recipes/blob/main/recipe...

This one!

I'd recommend pointing your agent at it (after installing sparkrun), and asking it to research the absolute latest in TP=1 Flash-Next - mine grabbed particular vLLM nightlies and mods to improve performance, and it was well worth it.

verdverm 29 minutes ago||
I have a quirky vLLM on k8s on 2x OEM sparks setup with 9 models available to me. I'm not keen to run nightly vLLM, too many issues with it in the past. Going the qwen-next path means displacing things I use daily :/

I have a watchful eye on the diffusion ~ Jev/Kev PR

https://github.com/vllm-project/vllm/pull/57250

girvo 21 minutes ago||
For what it's worth, Flash Next outperforms every other model that is available to us on the GB10 in all of my testing; though if you have two sparks then the TP=2 version is even better and easier (I don't think you'll need the nightly for that at all, just use the recipe)

I'm so tempted to buy a second one...

verdverm 17 minutes ago||
prices have gone up quite a bit...

I'm running embedding, reranking, and policy tuned models too, and a Jev/Kev when that's landed. Flash Next is not a substitute for those

I have OpenCode/Fireworks to access big models

verdverm 38 minutes ago|||
looks like this is likely it

https://github.com/spark-arena/eugr-recipes

https://github.com/eugr/spark-vllm-docker

girvo 1 hour ago||||
Nah, I’m streaming ngrams off NVMe on my Spark-alike right now. Works surprisingly well (except for when I accidentally bottlenecked it through my NAS)
jkingsman 28 minutes ago|||
What kind of throughput do you see on what models?
verdverm 7 minutes ago||
check out the spark arena website, its the raison d'etre
verdverm 1 hour ago|||
interesting, peer comment seems to indicate this is a possibility as well, will have to take a deeper look
petu 1 hour ago||||
n-grams can be kept on SSD, no need to hold them in any kind of RAM (at least w/o batching)
stymaar 1 hour ago|||
Am I missing a joke? WTF is URAM?
verdverm 1 hour ago||
unified memory, not sure if anyone uses URAM, I human hallucinated it
volf_ 48 minutes ago||
I've got a working recipe to run this model on Dual DGX Spark: https://github.com/volfco/spark-vllm-docker/blob/main/recipe...

Averages ~25-35tok/s which isn't bad for a first attempt.

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