Posted by LecroJS 15 hours ago
Ask HN: Which TV do you recommend for privacy?
I have heard good things about Apple TV as a better alternative to most smart TV native apps. Would some TV’s pair better with this than others for privacy? I don’t want the TV doing anything other than being the display for Apple TV.
I am curious what success others have had.
Now many people are also claiming that TVs will surreptitiously connect to an open network, but as far as I can tell, there is no evidence of this actually happening [0]. Of course it’s technically possible, but until a researcher actually observes this behavior I would not lose sleep over this.
[0]: https://www.rtings.com/tv/learn/how-to-use-smart-tv-offline
Smart TVs are just a normie alternative for what tech enthusiasts were doing for 30ish years: put a computer next to the tv and use it.
Alternative, get yourself something capable of running Moonlight (https://moonlight-stream.org/) and run Sunshine (https://app.lizardbyte.dev/Sunshine/) on your workstation, I am even playing games this way. RPI 5 works great, also libreelec (https://libreelec.tv/) is excellent and has Moonshine plugin.
You buy a TV, NEVER connect it to the internet and set up small computer next to it. Obviously not Android based as it is spyware on its own.
Then use it. It is that simple. No special methods, software, whatever needed, tv becomes only a large monitor for your computer conveniently placed in living room.
Weren’t there reports of smart TVs that connected to nearby unsecured TVs of the same manufacturer so they could download firmware and send telemetry?
https://www.bestbuy.com/product/samsung-65-inch-commercial-4...
Turn it on and it wants me to make an account, agree to a new TOS update once a month, comes with the full smart TV interface junk. Had no idea that was even a thing they were doing to monitors when I bought it.
I have a few year old LG oled and keep it offline.
- A TV has a backlight. It doesn't feel as 'natural' to the eye when watching because you are staring directly at an LED.
- A TV is smaller than a projector.
- A TV, when it is off, imposes itself on the room. It's a large plastic/glass object which is obviously electronic. It invades the space.
- Most TV's are full of surveillanceware.
- A TV can be watched even during the day, when it's bright outside. The projector, by contrast, is much less pleasant during the day; I consider this a feature - I should be doing something else when the sun is out. (The only time this kinda sucks is sports. We make do with closing the curtains).
- Movies were made for the silver screen, imho. This might be a hipster opinion but in my view, the medium really does make a difference in this regard; the moviegoing experience is better.
To specifically answer your question - most projectors are just a dumb HDMI cable. Computer, media center PC, apple TV, etc. None (unless I'm not aware of newer models) have an app store, tracking, or other garbage.
However, this:
> The projector, by contrast, is much less pleasant during the day
Was a significant enough drawback to me that it ruled it out as a daily driver. Although I do like the way you framed it.
In saying that, even this setup won't be able to match the deep blacks of a modern OLED TV in bright environments, but if you haven't been spoilt by OLEDs already, then a USTLP + UST-ALR is a really good alternative.
Its unbelievably talkative over the network! In the 7 days just passed, its been 90% of the blocked requests by volume (there's no allowed domains from that IP).
I'm still not convinced it isn't sneaking out data somehow - piggybacking off a connection somewhere to the neighbors TV. Its HDMI runs through a stereo amplifier, so it can't piggy-back off the connected PC that runs it.
Maybe the PC (Mint) can run AirPlay somehow and I can disconnect it entirely from the internet?
I feel overly paranoid about this device relative to everything else in the house, I'm not sure how justified that is.
I think we've overshot the mark a bit about TVs' connection abilities. A built-in SIM was one early conjecture. And while it hasn't been seen in the wild, it is often assumed to exist.
More to your point, we've not seen connections (assumedly ad-hoc wifi) to a neighboring device and uploading data to manufacturer, partner, etc.
We have recently seen a case of data collection, that included wifi scans. What we have not seen is a device that connects to other APs on it's own.
I saw 1 redditor claim that this occurred but it was not substantiated. Lots of folks are looking for this behavior but it hasn't been found.
This tells me that our existing methods of self-protection are effective.
More practically, when I am not using that, I just watch tv shows and such on my desktop computer running NixOS with a nice and modern (1440p 170Hz high quality but not highest possible end IPS) monitor over displayport.
Other options include a projector, buying a very large computer monitor marketed panel, or using something that is modern enough to be fine, but not so new that it has malware in it (like a friend who was moving gave me a very heavy but also very nice plasma tv, with zero malware on it).
Basically, anything except something marketed as a consumer grade TV. The last time that I had to displeasure of dealing with that it was when my parents bought one and asked me to set it up, and the built-in Roku software refusde to even display from an HDMI or DP input unless it was logged in and connected to WiFi! Alas, I was not able to convince them to return it, but I did decline to have anything to do with it.
Your TV is probably just one of the many devices that sends a scary amount of requests to a bunch of shady servers. With a firewall + DNS server that you control and a decent blocklist you should be able to block most requests and you won't be exposed if a new device connects to your network (for whatever reason).
Yes, those are good options, but in true HN spirit, my suggestion is a plain Linux distro. The firewall/router is just a few iptables lines, which AI can now provide in a few seconds.
Then connect either your computer directly to it or if you want something fancier, use an Apple TV.
Anything else is just too much pain - you can spend a lot of time debloating your TV, but then you either break updates (not good) or the updates will revert it and you are back on the square one. Not fun unless it is your hobby somehow.
And as a bonus, these devices are almost never monitored - you probably don't monitor it's CPU or network usage which makes it a good candidate for this sort of things.
Samsung the frame 65" for $2000 constantly pesters about $15 monthly subscription to change the art on the display to their selection of public domain historical artworks. Otherwise you're stuck with the default slideshow, which you're now forced to see since the whole sales pitch of the display is showing art when turned off.
atleast they had the decency to not show ads as default art instead... but i wouldn't put it past them