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Posted by pseudolus 1 hour ago

AI is forcing us to pay off 40 years of technical debt(spectrum.ieee.org)
165 points | 71 commentspage 2
jareklupinski 1 hour ago|
personally have started going the other way: AI-assisted microkernels, and only the programming that is actually needed for the problem at hand

my webserver never needed a million lines of code just to pass bytes to other people

m000 1 hour ago||
And that's the biggest win with AI. With old-fashioned development, it was considered acceptable to defer addressing valid feedback ad infinitum, hiding behind whatever lousy excuse you could come up with. No more.
mawadev 1 hour ago||
I'm personally not sharing the connotations of negativity towards software development and the term technical debt. I keep reading implications that most of this has always been in some way preventable, but it really is not that simple. How did nobody find these types of exploits 40 years ago? Why are we suddenly shocked and blame the field for this? I think the majority of people severely underestimate the complexity and seriousness of software. Once that perception stops and the economic incentives are right, we can start to look closer.

Just consider how laughable some working conditions in software are and then come to realize how architecture is shaped by the organization communication patterns and not reality. You will see it in a different light then.

program_whiz 1 hour ago||
What's hillarious is people vibe coding massive AI apps thinking its not creating tech debt and security holes. If anything, AI is discovering existing holes, and creating them faster than ever before in history.

All those "paying down" technical debt with AI, I would advise reading the code _very_ carefully. Sometimes the "solution" which passes some test or adheres to some described functionality is incredibly narrow / brittle, and/or has failure cases that are non-obvious.

Yes I'm using $latest_model on high, its still not there. Unless your threshold for "fixed" is "the 1M line lean proof runs, we don't know how it works", it still requires a lot of attention, hand-holding, and scrutiny, especially when fixing issues / working around failures (where it tends to shortcut or invent workarounds).

fg137 5 minutes ago||
A developer on my team introduced new features behind feature flags despite concerns about whether we should have those features and how they are going to be maintained. Changes touched 200+ files which is half of the files.

Turns out nobody wants to use them, they caused many subtle bugs in existing features and is a distraction for many things we do.

The developer left the team, and I am left with purging all of this.

tjohnell 29 minutes ago||
The same can be said with human-written code. LLM code is by far better than the average developer’s code at this point, and there’s not enough top percentile developers to go around, so it’s a wonderful tool.

Also, those very average developers are also the ones doing the code review.

Kevin_Flynn 1 hour ago||
Earlier this year, the cybersecurity firm Calif offered to independently audit PHP, sponsored by OpenAI. Within two weeks, a researcher at Calif, aided by AI tools, found a way to use the out-of-memory bug to run arbitrary code on the host server, allowing a malicious actor to install malware or read critical data. Now, it was no longer a minor bug—it was a critical vulnerability, and the Calif team alerted the PHP foundation to start working on a patch immediately.

So, the headline should read,

"AI is helping us eliminate 40 years of technical debt."

Since AI found the bug, and probably also generated the patch at this point.

An abundance of solutions is a problem for people who sell solutions.

eecc 1 hour ago||
I'm not going to lie, I'm having a great time thinking at the endless discussions around unsafe languages and the relentless smugness of many practitioners claiming everything was fine as long as the responsible and the skilled (them) were in charge; and let's not forget the formulaic "with great power comes great responsibility" closers.

Well now, Great Responsibles, it's clear you too were out of your collective depth and were all paying for your smug hubris. Perhaps take a bite out of that humble pie you've obviously never tasted?

stevefan1999 1 hour ago||
And you know how are those technical debts created in the first place? More than 40 years of negligence in IT infrastructure.
CyberDildonics 51 minutes ago|
What does that mean exactly?
jmyeet 51 minutes ago||
I think we'll look back at this moment as peak C/C++ before they begin a long, slow decline into irrelevance.

I've been bullish on Rust for years because memory safety is simply too important and Rust can essentially prove an implementation correct and solve a certain class of very important bugs. It doesn't solve every problem and there is a complexity cost.

I've also said that writing multithreaded code is simply too complex. In an era of out-of-order execution, different levels of caching, asymmetric cores, hyperthreading (although this is largely dead now?), branch prediction and having to support multiple architectures it's simply too hard for most people to write correct multithreaded code. Period. If you find yourself as a non-library developer creating a mutex or spawning a thread, somebody has screwed up.

This is also why I think the single-threaded async/await model with post-request teardown of PHP is the correct choice for most people.

We're going to go through a dark period of a lot of 0days. As the article notes, this is paying 40 years of technical debt. It will result in a more secure ecosystem however. I believe this will ultimately also hamper black markets, governments and 3 letter agencies who trade in those 0days.

As painful as this all is, it will ultimately be a good thing, one of the few to come out of AI (IMHO).

bearjaws 1 hour ago||
We've patched more bugs and more vulnerabilities in the last 3 months than entire years at my last job.

I fear it's only going to get worse.

EQYV 1 hour ago||
Worse?
IshKebab 1 hour ago||
Better you mean? Or are you saying you prefer having unfixed bugs?
pixl97 45 minutes ago||
Worse as in having to stay up late patching more bugs.
amelius 1 hour ago|
I'm sure the NSA has an eye on the groups that are asking AI about security issues in various popular softwares ...
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