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Posted by fleahunter 3 days ago

Sick of smart TVs? Here are your best options(arstechnica.com)
622 points | 523 commentspage 3
bradley13 3 days ago|
I'm a huge fan of projectors. With large TVs, you have a huge black wall when you aren't watching. With a projector you can have a pull-down screen that disappears when you don't need it. Or leave it down - it's white, and a lot less visually intrusive.
globular-toast 3 days ago|
The only problem with projectors is there's not much choice if you're sensitive to DLP rainbow effect. I haven't tried one of the newer ones with a faster colour wheel, though. It means I've had to go JVC DLA projectors, but these are now ridiculously expensive and I can't see myself ever spending that much on, well, anything.
sod 2 days ago|||
Yes, projectors with 3LCD tech is what you are looking for. They produce all 3 colors at once via 3 distinct lcds inside the chassis and mix them ahead of time. There are a few to choose from, but they all cost above 3000.

The reason why projectors don't use a single rgb lcd (like monitors) to produce the color is the same why all sub 5000$ projectors use pixel shift to fake 4k resolution: Too much light is blocked by the lcd itself if the individual pixels become too small.

bpye 2 days ago|||
I am somewhat sensitive to the effect and have been okay with an X3000i. If I scan my eyes across a black screen with white text, I can still perceive the effect - but it's nowhere near as bad as some older DLP projectors.
bpye 3 days ago||
I have a projector, a BenQ X3000i, in my living room, with a retractable screen. It has the plus side of not needing a dedicated wall, but does perform poorly (vs a TV) if the room isn't darkened. Maybe eventually I'll tie it into my home automation with some smart curtains.

It has low latency, will do 1080p 240Hz, 4k (pixel shift) 60Hz and HDR. Can even do 3D content if you really want...

BenQ did include an Android TV stick in the box, but you can just not hook it up to the projector - problem solved.

zeristor 3 days ago||
Absurdly although I’m, currently paying for a BBC TV licence, I use an Apple TV but they have not, and will not provide UHD content for it on their streaming app.

Either I can do the stupid thing and connect my LG TV to the network, or through various means download the UHD content, and therefore have to manage it, especially the last watched position, or forego it.

Having ADHD, I never really watch to the end, and so rely so much on the saved position to resume.

jan_nan 3 days ago|
TV devices are a hot mess to support from a streaming perspective, they each come with their own quirks that mean some perfectly-in-spec encoding and packaging techniques will result in a failed playback on some models of TV. Once a TV device _is_ supported, that support has to be maintained typically for more than a decade until usage of that model falls so low that dropping it from support can be justified.

It would be prohibitively costly to produce per-device renditions so instead there is one generic rendition produced for "all smart TVs" and another one for "UHD capable smart TVs".

Traditional TV manufacturers all work with the BBC to get their devices certified, which is a requirement for carrying the iPlayer app and comes with legal agreements that asset that a device _will_ be able to playback BBC content for as long as it's supported.

Because Apple like to Think Differently, they opted not to align with the entire rest of the TV industry in standardising on MPEG-DASH spec. They instead require all developers to stream video using the HLS protocol. As UHD content on iPlayer is geared exclusively for smart TVs, and all the other smart TVs support MPEG-DASH, the UHD workflow simply never evolved the ability to target Apple's TV devices.

mattacular 2 days ago||
1. buy any model that meets your specs (i like TCL)

2. setup a one time use wifi network with randomized SSID and password (hotspot from your phone works well)

3. connect your tv to it and update to latest software

4. delete the wifi config and reset that network (roll to new SSID and password)

5. connect an apple tv set top box and never use any of the tv features ever again

MrMember 2 days ago|
Smart TVs are so user hostile now that this doesn't work for me personally anymore. Every TV I've seen recently always tries to get back to the "home" screen so they can funnel you into more ads and/or content that makes them money. If I have the TV set to the HDMI source for my connected HTPC, turn off the TV, and turn it back on again, it will be back on the TV's home screen. If I switch to an HDMI source that isn't currently outputting video it will switch back to the home screen in five seconds. I was at a friend's house over Thanksgiving and when he tried to navigate away from the home screen on his Vizio TV to a different HDMI input he got a confirmation dialog box with an ad embedded in it asking him "are you SURE you want to change inputs?" It's ridiculous.

For now I spend the extra money for "digital display" TVs that are just dumb input for HDMI devices but I fear that someday that option will either disappear or fall significantly behind regular TVs in display technology.

mattacular 2 days ago||
Try TCL. I just got a second one after 6 years with a previous model of theirs that was showing signs of death. On both this new (Google-based OS) and old one (Roku-based OS), I have done the steps I mentioned above. I wouldn't have bothered typing that up if it didn't work.

Turning a HDMI device on wakes the TV and then it automatically selects that input. I've never been to the homescreen except by choice, and even then it is completely stock. Barebones, no ads - it has no internet to get any.

MrMember 1 day ago||
Thanks for the recommendation! I'll check them out.
symbogra 3 days ago||
My wife and I have been wondering about exactly this question and are on the market for a new TV, and this list of options is really sad. 720p? 32"? Yeesh
djmips 3 days ago|
there was a 55" 4K option but your point stands. Yeesh.
mrandish 3 days ago||
If you already have a "smart TV" of some kind, one strategy is to block it from having Internet access at your router and then use an Android TV based streaming box/stick or other external source for all content (OTA tuner, 4K Blu-Ray player, game console, etc). It's pretty easy to side load apps like Kodi and SmartTube on Android TV (a YouTube client with ad blocking, other features and zillion UX improvements).
robmsmt 3 days ago|
What’s wrong with never configuring the WiFi for it?
aprilnya 2 days ago|||
Connecting it to Wifi means you can use Airplay, Chromecast, Miracast..
Grazester 3 days ago|||
...Not a damn thing. Makes you wonder if people on here connect their smart tv to the net just to find a complicated solution to make it dumb again.

Someone is going to run in here talking about how smart TV's randomly connect themselves to wifi, which is absolutely nonsense.

HN things I guess.

gbear605 2 days ago||
It depends on the manufacturer, but a lot of new ones show pop ups until you connect to a network
AlecSchueler 3 days ago||
Don't bring one into your house?
teeray 3 days ago||
TV Manufacturers: “oh no!” *proceeds to remove all dumb TVs from the market*
AlecSchueler 3 days ago||
There's a second hand market.
asdff 3 days ago||
For now. Try getting a good CRT today. Most all the good ones were sent to the dump.
wkjagt 3 days ago||
The article goes into that option.
aquir 3 days ago||
Don’t ever connect your TV to the internet?
sys_64738 3 days ago||
I'm expecting that later ones will contain methods to get out however they can, whether that's connecting to xfinity free wifi, connecting to a satellite, or having a cheap cell connection that is always on. They want your data and will do their damnedest to get it with/without your permission. Geolocation will be found. I'd expect they'll scan your local wifi SSIDs and send those too and ethernet MAC address to figure out who you are. There must be methods of using this info to wrangle your identity for marketing purposes.
cgh 3 days ago|||
There are still annoyances. Our TV finds every opportunity to send you to its home screen of apps, requiring me to reset the input to the PS5 that we use for Netflix etc. And regardless, I don't want to pay for a lousy customised Android with a bunch of crappy apps preinstalled.
nottorp 3 days ago|||
Better be far enough from the neighbor's password less wifi.
allarm 3 days ago||
Please provide a specific example of a tv that does that, or stop spreading misinformation.
nottorp 2 days ago||
I was just extrapolating. Why wouldn't a "smart" device connect to any wifi it has credentials for, and why wouldn't the implementation consider "has credentials" to include "it doesn't need any"?

But now I wonder why your aggressivity sounds so defensive.

orangecat 2 days ago||
Why wouldn't a "smart" device connect to any wifi it has credentials for, and why wouldn't the implementation consider "has credentials" to include "it doesn't need any"?

Practically because lots of "open" wifi networks have captive portals that don't actually get you Internet access without further action, and legally because using random networks without user confirmation is rather dodgy.

But now I wonder why your aggressivity sounds so defensive.

It's an urban legend that people keep repeating, and nobody can ever point to a specific case of it happening. It would be extremely easy to demonstrate: set up an open network, take a new or factory-reset TV, and wait.

rationalist 3 days ago|||
Don't ever let anyone else connect your TV to the internet either.
M95D 3 days ago||
They nag.
dfxm12 3 days ago|||
Some brands are better than others. I bought a Sony Bravia TV less than a year ago. The nags are infrequent (maybe every fifth time I turn it on) and unobtrusive (a toast notification pops up in the upper right corner of the screen for a few seconds; it's gone by the time the Fire Stick UI comes up).

Getting rid of ads on the streaming stick and various streaming services is an interesting challenge though...

raw_anon_1111 3 days ago||||
I’ve had plenty of RokuTVs and my previous home had wired gig e Internet in every room. I plugged the TV to the Ethernet to get software updates, unplugged it, set the TV to always switch to the HDMI port with my AppleTV connected and never thought about the Roku again.

The AppleTV supports CEC and controls the power and the volume.

No nagging

anonym29 3 days ago||||
This must be a very new or not universal feature. I have an Element E4AA70R 70" 4K UHD HDR10 Roku TV I picked up in mid-2023 for well below $1000. It has never once been connected to the internet, and it doesn't nag me.
M95D 3 days ago||
I rented an apartment that had an LG. It showed a FOMO-inducing popup every week.
matheusmoreira 3 days ago|||
Might still be possible to jailbreak LG TVs. Not sure what the quality of the homebrew TV firmware situation is like though. Maybe not stable enough for family use.
RajT88 3 days ago||
I have an LG C3. The old jailbreak no longer works.

I keep avoiding the upgrade to keep the possibility open. At some point they force upgrade your firmware.

anonym29 3 days ago|||
Any information on model number so people can compare, learn from your experience, etc?
nickthegreek 3 days ago||||
Maybe some brands do (feel free to name them). My Samsung does not.
0x457 3 days ago||
However, if you do connect, then Samsung pushes so many updates (more ads) than anyone else. My ancient samsung tv in the garage was getting weekly updates for some reason.
guerrilla 3 days ago||||
My Phillips 65" doesn't. I just have it connected to my old PC via HDMI. Don't need any smart features.
sys_64738 3 days ago|||
I've not experience that on my TCL.
mastazi 3 days ago||
I have the exact setup shown towards the end of the article - HTPC and K400 keyboard/touchpad. I have tried all "smart" platforms in the past, and this setup is an order of magnitude better in everything. I used to have issues where a specific content provider doesn't have an app for my type of smart TV[1], this is no longer an issue because I just use a browser to access anything. And I can browse the web when I'm not watching something[2] (in fact I'm using my HTPC right now as I write this comment).

The only change I had to make starting from a "standard" Linux UI is bumping the screen zoom level to 150%. This may vary depending on your TV size and how far your couch is from your TV.

Building the HTPC was very cheap, I just boughs a horizontal form-factor case, and used spare "donor" parts coming from our household PCs after upgrades.

[1][2]For comparison, the only streaming platform that had all apps I wanted was Apple TV, but that one doesn't have a browser.

athrun 3 days ago|
the big issue with this setup is that most streaming platforms won’t give you multi-channel audio via the browser on Linux systems. Some might also limit the video quality.

On Windows, it used to be different, but lately I’ve observed the same—ex: Netflix seems to limit the streaming quality even with Edge.

asdff 3 days ago||
If you really care about fidelity you’d skip the streaming and either have a collection of new and used blurays, rip blu rays from the library, or pirate bluray rips from other people.

No one offers actual fidelity on the streaming platforms. They consider cost to them to serve content and assume you don’t care enough to seek alternatives.

tuna74 1 day ago||
Some movies like Avangers End Game are presented in 16X9 Dolby Vision on Disney+ vs 1X2.35 HDR10 on UHD Blu-ray. You can look up comparisons on Youtube if you want to.

So it is not always the case that the UHD disk is better in all aspects.

asdff 1 day ago||
I'm sure someones ripped that dolby vision stream for you
guidedlight 3 days ago|
I’m fairly certain that Sony TV’s ask you where you want to use it as a Smart TV or a Dumb TV when setting it up.
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