Top
Best
New

Posted by iancmceachern 15 hours ago

Toyota Mirai hydrogen car depreciation: 65% value loss in a year(carbuzz.com)
131 points | 302 commentspage 3
HoldOnAMinute 8 hours ago|
The last time I checked local ads, they were giving these cars away free, and you could get a tax deduction. They were paying you to take it.
swifferfan 9 hours ago||
Obligatory paper - Does a Hydrogen Economy Make Sense? (2006)

https://alpha.chem.umb.edu/chemistry/ch471/evans%20files/Pro...

Nothing fundamental has changed in the last 2 decades to refute the arguments Bossel made in 2006.

dizhn 9 hours ago||
According to some youtube (doomer) videos I watched a lot of EVs and luxury cars also had this kind of depreciation lately.
helterskelter 13 hours ago||
I've seen exactly one of these in person while in San Diego for a month or so. I never did see a fueling station for it though.
kotaKat 12 hours ago|
There's only... well, 51 of them. If you're lucky, you're near one of the 42 that are actually online and available for fueling (as of this comment).

Stations running out of fuel and stations going offline for hardware failures runs rampant.

Oh, and some stations might not be able to provide the highest pressure H2, so you might be stuck taking an 85% tank fill... and at nearly $30/kg and a 5.6kg (full) tank, that's an expensive fill.

https://h2-ca.com/

peterfirefly 11 hours ago||
And they are not even supposed to explode anymore!
cryptoegorophy 7 hours ago||
Sorry. EVs won.
stevenhubertron 10 hours ago||
Cars are not investments.
1970-01-01 10 hours ago|
Depends on the car. Some are so special they will have a better ROI than your retirement plan.

https://www.myartbroker.com/investing/articles/top-10-most-i...

constantcrying 12 hours ago||
When comparing EVs to hydrogen cars it is very obvious that one is the superior solution.

An EV is a clear simplification of an ICE. Add a Battery and replace the mechanical complexity of a combustion engine with a relatively simple electric motor. So many components are now unnecessary and so many problems just go away. EVs also make charging simpler.

Hydrogen cars on the other hand are very complex and also quite inefficient, requiring many steps to go from hydrogen generation to motor movement. And they require a very sophisticated network of charging infrastructure, which has to deal with an explosive gas at high pressures. Something which is dangerous even in highly controlled industrial environments.

I just do not see a single reason why hydrogen cars would catch on. EVs are good already and come with many benefits.

glitchc 11 hours ago|
> An EV is a clear simplification of an ICE. Add a Battery and replace the mechanical complexity of a combustion engine with a relatively simple electric motor. So many components are now unnecessary and so many problems just go away. EVs also make charging simpler.

Is it? Then why isn't it cheaper to produce and cheaper to own?

> Hydrogen cars on the other hand are very complex and also quite inefficient, requiring many steps to go from hydrogen generation to motor movement. And they require a very sophisticated network of charging infrastructure, which has to deal with an explosive gas at high pressures. Something which is dangerous even in highly controlled industrial environments.

It's a standard combustion engine, nothing special.

mjamesaustin 11 hours ago|||
EVs are cheaper to own – the fuel savings are enormous.

EVs aren't cheaper to produce yet, but battery costs are still falling and they will reach parity with ICE vehicles soon.

bdangubic 11 hours ago||
EVs are so much more cheaper to own that it is difficult to explain to people who own ICE cars as they, in majority of cases, just cannot comprehend it
MindSpunk 8 hours ago||||
You're both wrong, the Mirai uses a fuel cell as the voltage source for an otherwise EV drive train. The Mirai is an EV with a fuel cell instead of a battery.

There is no ICE in a Mirai.

vel0city 10 hours ago|||
My EV has cost me ~$1,100/yr less to operate over the last few years for the same mileage compared to my ICE, and I didn't even have any major issues with my ICE. Meanwhile its been charged with almost exclusively 100% renewable, zero-emission energy.
sksasi 11 hours ago||
A full tank would cost $200 for about 300-350 mile range.
sremani 13 hours ago||
I once did some research on Mirai and found at that time Plano, TX where Toyota NA is Headquartered did not have a Hydrogen station. Not sure if they have one now. It is such a limited car and because of the infrastructure stuck to LA and San Diego, I guess.

Pure range is 500+ miles but not many Hydrogen stations.

oceanplexian 10 hours ago|
If you think depreciation on a few cars is bad wait until you find out how many hundreds of millions taxpayers spent to build hydrogen stations for cars that don’t exist.

At least it’s not as blatant of a green energy scam as the high speed rail to nowhere. In this case they actually built a few stations that worked.

More comments...