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Posted by pabs3 9 hours ago

Motorola GrapheneOS devices will be bootloader unlockable/relockable(grapheneos.social)
651 points | 190 commentspage 3
lordofgibbons 7 hours ago|
Given that Google has said they'll be delaying source code release for Android to every X months intervals (iirc), how is GrapheneOS planning to handle security updates? Will they just be Google's binary blobs?
izacus 1 hour ago||
Motorola is a partner that has access to Android source sooner.
zeech 7 hours ago||
Graphene already uses binary blobs (though one can disable them if they want). Info at [0].

[0] https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/27068-grapheneos-security-p...

khimaros 7 hours ago||
this isn't quite right. the blobs are produced by GrapheneOS and are reproducible once the source code embargo lifts.
zeech 6 hours ago||
Whoops, nice catch - comment edited.
jaypatelani 3 hours ago||
I hoped they would have gone with HMD or BlackBerry.
forkerenok 3 hours ago|
Why? Multiple times in the last 8 or so years I've considered both Nokia (HMD) and Motorola. Looking at reviews and specs I decided every time in favor of Motorola, despite liking the design of Nokia's more, and didn't regret it.
smashah 7 hours ago||
Whatever this device is is at the top of my list for my next phone.
LoganDark 7 hours ago||
Do we know if there there be Widevine L1 keys that aren't deleted on unlock? (Certain phones restore access to L1 on bootloader relock, as long as AVB passes, including with custom keys.)
yegle 7 hours ago||
I think Pixel phones are also unlockable/relockable?
dietr1ch 7 hours ago||
Samsung did restrict side-loading recently,

- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47202808

I'm sure that Google will do something like that as soon as it faced the US's carrot and stick they signed-up for.

jeroenhd 51 minutes ago||
That's not really sideloading, though. The stock recovery doesn't let you install apps or anything like that, it's meant for loading official versions of Samsung operating systems onto devices that got corrupted somehow.

You can probably try to use the stock recovery to flash a custom ROM, but I doubt it'll work. Custom ROMs rely on tools like TWRP or LineageOS Recovery for a reason.

H8crilA 7 hours ago||
This is how you can install GrapheneOS on these. Also, if you're wondering how does the security of something like this work: if you change the boot hash then the phone forgets all the hardware-stored secrets, for example the disk encryption keys.
jMyles 8 hours ago||
Even though there doesn't seem to be huge mainstream consumer demand for this (although I actually question how well consumer demand for privacy and customization can ever be ascertained when the price signals are corrupted by a market where the winning players are essentially chosen by the state, as is arguably the case with both TSMC and Qualcomm), it still feels like the world simply couldn't go on with both iOS and Android become caged, cheapened, fragile shadows of the visions we once had for them (particularly AOSP).
windexh8er 7 hours ago||
Not to be flippant but who cares? People don't know there's an option. I've run Graphene for years and will gladly pay a premium for it. Beyond the bolstered security the battery life is exponentially better than a default Android device because of all the constant background traffic that Google doesn't allow any control over that you instantly have a choice with on GrapheneOS.

And as soon as you start showing these things to people they do start to care and ask how. So the fact that the mainstream is ignorant and doesn't care enough yet doesn't matter because it's very likely a much larger segment of users will care when the tech evangelists they trust stop using IOS and Google Android. That's how these things started and that's how they could very well play out in this scenario as well.

jMyles 7 hours ago||
Yes, I agree in full. Did you think I was taking a position contrary to this one?
dietr1ch 8 hours ago|||
I think we can only expect the demand for privacy to grow into the future given that people tracking in a trenchcoat schemes are popping up everywhere through governmental and private efforts trying to gather data for ads and control.
dmix 7 hours ago||
Not all markets are trendy B2C stuff. The Motorola press release specifically mentioned B2B/corporate sales where security is important and there's plenty of government, journalist, non-profits/activists, etc usecases on top of the usual corporate locked-down environments like banking.
yooastan 7 hours ago||
A physical keyboard device with GrapheneOS would mog
backscratches 30 minutes ago||
The future is now (or 2027)! 4" screen and hardware keyboard and graphene!

https://www.clicks.tech/en/products/clicks-keyboard-for-moto...

I cannot overstate my excitement.

WithinReason 1 hour ago|||
Just buy a keyboard case for it, no need for permanent attachment. Or carry a tiny bluetooth keyboard in your pocket:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0FWC8G2Q8/

bitwize 58 minutes ago||
Ah, Doohoeek, a time-honored, trusted brand.
mrbuttons454 6 hours ago||
Hopefully it gets a port to the Clicks Communicator. From what I understand the bootloader will be unlockable.
alexander9866 4 hours ago||
Does this have more security, Please let me know share the details
Imustaskforhelp 3 hours ago|
Is this feature gonna be on All phones including Low-end/mid-end (4-8Gb ram) and their flagship phones?

It's gonna be huge if that's the case because Pixel's here are expensive, their second hand prices are in "non-global" countries[0] and you have to pay a premium. Also I live in world's largest second-hand phone market and it can have its worries as well.

You can't say to anyone who wants privacy, oh just buy a second-hand pixel. It's just not that easy.

But if Motorola can launch multiple phones and there are always gonna be some deals one way or another (with cards) and as motorola phones are pretty competitive in price, Finally we can have phones worldwide where privacy isn't charged extra.

I have spent some hours looking at online second hand phone stores to find but due to its somewhat rarity, I always feel like being frugal, I am just paying extra for privacy and so I am really happy with decision from motorola using their supply chain of phones and partnering up with Graphene.

I was gonna buy a phone for myself, I was thinking a second hand pixel phone but given the things I said earlier at this point, I might as well wait for a few more months to get the moto phone.

I just hope that they launch an affordable phone with grapheneos. I really don't care about specs as I have been able to live my life with 7 year old motorola phones too in 2026 for sometime.

I will definitely recommend my family Motorola phones in the future and slowly convert everyone to motorola if motorola releases an affordable phone with actual privacy.

[0]:https://www.xcitium.com/blog/news/why-is-google-pixel-not-gl...

backscratches 29 minutes ago|
graphene has said only flagships at first, but eventually they hope to end up on lower tier devices.
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