Top
Best
New

Posted by prismatic 1 day ago

The Melancholy of Slaying Monsters(thereader.mitpress.mit.edu)
249 points | 120 commentspage 3
rob74 11 hours ago|
I wonder how they arrived at the name "Ebrietas"? Does it have something to do with being inebriated?

EDIT: it does, I just had to google "Ebrietas latin" (and got https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ebrietas), otherwise it only returned references to the monster.

gainda 4 hours ago||
From what I recall there is a relationship in the game of how much blood you take from an outer being like her & how crazy (drunk?) the user then becomes, before becoming a crazed beast.

There is one key item in the game called “Eyes of a blood-drunk hunter”

tptacek 2 hours ago|||
It's designed after a moth species.
shakna 11 hours ago||
Probably more likely related to the Mexican moth, considering the character designs.
PaulHoule 7 hours ago||
Makes me think of that dragon that you can sneak up to near the beginning of Elden Ring and take it out with chip damage over about half an hour without waking it up.
m_aiswaryaa 10 hours ago||
On a similar theme, The old knight and the dragon: https://www.instagram.com/p/DY0YtdtHdLb/?img_index=1
ajuc 12 hours ago||
No mention of the Witcher? The whole franchise is based on moral dilemmas like that.
xxs 11 hours ago||
There are so few (2) succubi mutagens in Witcher3. Gotta do what you gotta do, 30% damage is nothing to scoff at.
Aerolfos 12 hours ago|||
Or Nier, which are inspired by and connected to Shadow of the Colossus in the same way as SotC is connected to Zelda (explicitly mentioned in the article)
ThrowawayR2 5 hours ago||
Agreed, Nier: Replicant definitely belongs in the list. Yoko Taro successfully asks "What if the opponents you fight were the main character of their own stories with their own good and justifiable motivations?" as well as any of the other games mentioned.
lukwoz 11 hours ago|||
Came here to mention the same thing. It's one of the pillars of the whole Witcher saga, but most clearly it's visible in Sapkowski's short stories - The Lesser Evil, A Grain of Truth, A Question of Price, The Witcher, to name just a few.
relaxing 6 hours ago||
Maybe the author, being Czech, wanted to look beyond the quintessential Slavic contribution to the genre. It’s the only explanation I can think of.

The idea that monsters can be understood, and spared because in the end they’re exhibiting human flaws, is such a powerful storytelling device.

xxs 5 hours ago||
>author, being Czech

Sapkowski is from Poland, though. Still Slav, but still.

fuzzfactor 2 hours ago||
Well I'm no gaming enthusiast so I have a very limited range that I can fully enjoy at my low accomplishment level.

Must be quite the opposite of a real gamer, so I naturally like the simpler and less complex approach.

More or less the easy stuff, and I'm not completely alone.

I think first and foremost, a particular game should be fun from quite early on before you have developed much deep experience, and then any progress through different levels should be logical and straightforward.

In both respects from my simple-minded starting point I guess I enjoy it most when it's about as rewarding as finishing off an order of french fries :)

Talk about excitement rising to melancholy amounts . . .

casey2 6 hours ago||
The Shadow of the Colossus video essay meme has transferred into text, we are devolving!
analog8374 7 hours ago||
These are their kitchens and living rooms. You leap in swinging your broadsword.
chiffre01 6 hours ago||
I mean this has been a this has been a theme going back further than "Shadow of the Colossus" or "Undertale".

Both "Chrono Trigger" and "Crono Cross" make you question your actions and whether or not it was worth on a monster genocide.

throwatdem12311 9 hours ago||
This article had me until it said the pacifist run in Undertale was more difficult. Anyone that has attempted a “genocide” route where you kill everyone will probably tell you that that boss is probably one of the hardest things they ever done in a videogame - if they can beat it at all.
cubefox 9 hours ago|
The article didn't say that a pacifist run was more difficult than a genocide route.
throwatdem12311 8 hours ago||
I never even considered one might play Undertale where you only kill some people but not others, the game doesn’t really ever incentivize you to do a “mixed” run.

Pacifist is more like a puzzle game, and I didn’t find it all that challenging at all.

If you go the “kill only some people” route, I don’t think you would ever really be strong enough for this to be fun due to not levelling up enough to keep up with later stage enemies. So you’re going to be heavily incentivized to go full pacifist to bypass levelling entirely or genocide to get enough levels. Then of course you’ll hit the wall at the end…

debugnik 4 hours ago|||
It takes some really serious farming to accidentally find genocide route and then not exit it my mistake. Most players blindly treating Undertale as a regular RPG would simply kill the enemies they encounter (which is not enough to trigger genocide route), maybe regret it along the way, and eventually get a neutral ending plus the hints to try pacifist.

It's clearly the intended progression, since the second playthrough then changes to reflect the fact that the game "remembers" your first one.

kmeisthax 4 hours ago|||
The funny thing is, not only are there multiple Neutral endings, Toby actually wrote different variations of them for almost every possible combination of boss kill. They range from "you know, Alphys wanted to talk to you about something" if you killed nobody, to "if Sans ever figures out how to leave the Underground, he will end you". The latter is what you'd get if you misinterpreted "Genocide run" to mean "kill everything you see", which isn't quite it.

My guess is that Toby's intent was for you to play the game normally, get one of the many, many different Neutral endings, reset to get the Pacifist ending, and then a few years later come back to Genocide after hearing about this weird route where you get to fight the other font skeleton.

kmeisthax 5 hours ago|
> Contrary to Flowey’s advice, the game can be finished without a single kill, leading to a special ending, but this pacifist route is markedly more difficult.

...huh? This is very much not true. The most difficult[0] encounters happen on the Genocide route, in which you powerlevel like it's a normal JRPG until the encounters run out. Pacifist is only slightly harder than a "No Mercy" neutral run[1].

For the first two thirds of this article I was screaming "BUT WHAT ABOUT UNDERTALE". Toby Fox basically wrote the book on the moral quandries of killing monsters in video games, and this article does not do his work justice. It feels like the author wanted to briefly mention it at the end as a way to cap off the essay. And, while I haven't played Shadow of the Colossus, I suspect the inspection of that is about as surface-level as the tacked-on mention of UNDERTALE at the end.

I feel like I just read a high school English essay.

[0] Mechanically and emotionally.

[1] As in, a run in which you kill everything you see, but do not exhaust the kill limit.

debugnik 4 hours ago||
> in which you powerlevel like it's a normal JRPG until the encounters run out

Regular JRPG farming is not enough to trigger this route. You need to farm out every single area with enemies, starting from the very first one and never leaving one unfarmed, otherwise you accidentally exit the route even if you keep trying. You seem to know this but somehow pretend it's the normal JRPG experience?

As for Shadow of the Colossus, this article has flaws but its analysis of that game isn't one of them. It's very much what "everyone" knows about the game.

WolfeReader 2 hours ago||
I think "the pacifist route is more difficult than the default route" and "The pacifist route is the hardest way to play the game" are two different statements. The article said the first, but you're reacting as if it said the second.
More comments...