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Posted by Buildstarted 5 hours ago

California AB 2047 makes 3D printers off-limits to students, educators, business(www.the3dprintingnerd.com)
238 points | 161 commentspage 2
exabrial 4 hours ago|
* Rebecca Bauer-Kahan (D)

* Dr. Darshana R. Patel (D)

* Tim Grayson (D)

p-e-w 4 hours ago|
“That’s what you get for voting for fascist Republicans! Turns out elections have consequences.” /s
LinuxAmbulance 5 hours ago||
What are the odds of this passing successfully?

A grim day for 3D printing if so.

Legend2440 4 hours ago||
The California legislature has a history of passing stupid stuff that later gets vetoed by Newsom. They tried to ban self-driving trucks last year.
calgoo 4 hours ago||
That does not sound stupid, but safe? I giant truck that has no chance of stopping, controlled by a computer? Just build railways and then there are no issues, no fancy AI to control them.
cortesoft 4 hours ago||
A giant truck that has no chance of stopping, controlled by a human is even more dangerous, but we don't outlaw those.
vor_ 4 hours ago||
How did you determine that it's even more dangerous?
Legend2440 4 hours ago||
Last year 43,230 people died in the US from motor vehicles driven by humans.
miohtama 4 hours ago|||
It will be a grim day for democracy as well
EmbarrassedHelp 4 hours ago||
If it becomes law, then other US states and countries will try to copy it as well.
Rebelgecko 3 hours ago|||
Doesn't NY already have something similar?
greenavocado 4 hours ago|||
You misunderstand the mechanism. Its not because states copy other states. Its because the corrosive political elements are embedded everywhere, but most prominently have a foothold in California, Washington, and New York state. There is an interstate conspiracy and agenda to ruin America. Louis Rossman covered it recently in his video "The destruction of 3D printing: Bloomberg is behind it"
UncleOxidant 3 hours ago||
There's also this Chip "Security" Act on the federal level: https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/chips-security-act-ga...
wxw 4 hours ago||
The actual bill in question: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml...

It seems more precise to say that 3D printers sold/transferred in California would need built-in anti-firearm-printing controls?

I don't see how this directly bans students/teachers/businesses from owning 3d printers, which is what the title seems to say.

kersplody 1 hour ago||
[flagged]
SpicyLemonZest 3 hours ago||
It does not. The gun lobby routinely lies about California regulations to try and get their way. They're on year 13 of boycotting the California handgun market, for example; new handgun models in the state are required to adopt microstamping technology, but firearms manufacturers are ideologically opposed to this technology, so they falsely claim that it doesn't exist.
swalsh 4 hours ago||
This offends me, because I believe code is speech, and speech should not be restricted.
int32_64 4 hours ago||
Are 3D-printed guns even remotely reliable, or is it just a moral panic? A brass tube and a pin is probably less likely to fail than 3d printed materials.
whartung 3 hours ago||
They’re not printing the metal parts. They’re printing the frame (as in “polymer framed handgun”).

The frame is the part that gets the serial number and is considered the controlled part of the gun. Rather than the trigger, the springs, the barrel, etc.

Other than the frame, which requires an FFL for transfer, especially across state lines, the rest of the parts can be ordered and shipped from anywhere and are not controlled.

Mind, that’s changing, again notably in CA, as they now talk about “gun pre-cursor” parts.

The 3D printed frames are similar to the “80% lowers” which are aluminum blocks that are “80%” complete AR-15 lowers (the lower receiver, again, the controlled part of an AR-15).

With straight forward machining and some jigs, those chunks of metal can be finished into an operational lower receiver, and the rest of the rifle can be assembled from disparate parts ordered from anywhere.

The original “ghost gun” before 3D printers enabled folks to assemble Glocks in their garage.

elzbardico 2 hours ago||
Wait. Do you mean I can simply buy barrels, a trigger mechanism, all without any special license, but not the frame?
wl 1 hour ago||
Correct.

Other countries regulate the pressure-bearing parts instead. It probably started off with a safety rationale (those parts are generally proof tested), but those parts ALSO tend to be the ones that are more difficult for someone to produce at home.

AngryData 2 hours ago|||
It is fearmongering. You technically can print an all-plastic firearm that works for a round or so until they explode, but only after you have already printed and tested and refined multiple times over, and best case it is still an inferior material to metal. I would put it in the same category as "Yeah you can turn a tree trunk into a cannon, tell me when not to come over when you use it." You can probably make a similarly reliable firearm out of fired clay if you put in the same effort.

Some parts in regular firearms can be printed in plastic, guns with polymer parts have existed since polymers existed, but it is only marginally simpler than machining it out of metal. After all you can buy a metal CNC machine for handful of bucks more than a 3d printer and you don't have to worry about shitty materials breaking immediately.

And there are already plenty of examples of hardware store pipe guns that if someone spent more than a day or two working on it would by far surpass anything anyone can print.

Rebelgecko 3 hours ago|||
People normally don't make guns that are entirely 3d printed. Homemade guns often get the parts exposed to highest stresses commercially.

Fwiw, when I paid attention to my local police department's released body cam vids, maybe around 1/3 of the guns they showed as evidence were polymer80s (edit: which I mistakenly assumed were 3d printed, but it turns out they aren't so feel free to disregard that fun fact)

mothballed 3 hours ago||
Polymer80 aren't 3d printed. They were injected molded as non-receivers and then the customer has to subtract some extra materials.

Polymer80 is defunct but still sold under a slightly different modified mold that someone mysterious somewhere owns and is selling through some other companies("76%" instead of 80%)

bluescrn 4 hours ago|||
In the US I believe there's many metal 'spare parts' for guns available, including the barrel, so don't need to print the whole thing. So they're usually not talking about entirely printed guns.

A pure plastic gun seems more likely to blow the users hand off than hit their target. Especially if just downloaded and printed in PLA on default settings (few walls, sparse infill...)

LorenPechtel 2 hours ago||
This. Guns contain many wear items.

So what the ATF does is take an essential part not substantially influenced by wear and declare it to be the gun. Trade in anything that sufficiently resembles this part is treated as trade in guns. Other parts are not considered guns, they're just pieces of metal or plastic. Then there are the parts that you're not supposed to have. But is that an oil filter or a silencer? When it's on the gun it's obvious, when it's listed on a website as an oil filter...

dgellow 4 hours ago|||
I know very little about guns but know 3d printing quite well. My understanding is that a fully 3d printed gun is not reliable, you need to acquire actual gun parts for the path where the bullet fires (the barrel?). Then can use 3d printing for the rest
mothballed 4 hours ago|||
They're pretty damn reliable if you either use a hybrid model (FGC-9) where the barrel is "explosion proof pipe" from china that is then electrically machined (easy with 3d printed mandrel) to form a nice rifled barrel.

Or you just 3d print the "receiver" for something like an Ar-15, which isn't load bearing. If you use the right materials and the beefier designs it will lats hundreds to thousands of rounds. The rest of the parts can be bought through the mails unregulated.

malwrar 4 hours ago||
I heard a billionaire is funding this, he’s probably afraid of the one famous instance of someone like him getting killed by one of those.
HoldOnAMinute 4 hours ago||
Which 3D Printers should I be buying right now?
KingMachiavelli 4 hours ago||
Err, the email list has like 13+ bad addresses? I get a lot of "Address not found" responses.
nullc 2 hours ago||
One of numerous awful policies and proposed policies that make me glad to have left California.
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